Eastern Illinois

[L-T]

This whole line of talk has come after 3 games? L-T, you have your right to your beliefs and I have supported your right to say it on many occasions, but listening to you is really getting old. You follow the straight and narrow until a couple of cracks in the armor happen and then the same arguments and complaints come back out again. I understand you want the program to be at the top but I also understand that you never will give Mick his due, you just don't like him and that is okay. But everyone knows your feelings now so please just give it a rest. If in March they are still playing this way you will have a lot more legs to stand on, but at that point I will be arguing that he didn't do a good enough job of bringing THIS team along, not that he hasn't been a success. Unfortunately knowing your pattern, even if they improve all year you will point out how other teams or other coaches would have done it better. I'm sorry I feel this way but you take all the fun out of what should be fun.

My post after the Morehead game....

Clark reminds me of another player who was an incredible bust in our program. He has no offensive game. He looks slow. He looks timid. I hate it when we recruit these type of players. That damn "bust" of a player coincidently was from North carolina also. His name was Eric Hicks. He even ended up quitting the team for a brief period as a freshman and only averaged 2 points per game. Everyone was highly disappointed with him too. Looks like we've probably got another one of those types of players with Clark.

As to whether or not Cobb will play like that in the future, when we recruited another unknown JC transfer named Nick Van Exel, we all had the same disbelief that he could sustain the first performance we saw that was amazing. Momentum and confidence are an amazing thing. That young man came alive last night and reminded me of the first time I was amazed by Nick Van Exel at about this same point in his first season with us. I'm going to choose to believe that last night was the real Farad Cobb and if it is, he may be the missing piece to this puzzle.....a real shooter finally.

I actually thought we looked rather good against the zone...not at first...but when Mick got the right players in there, we attacked it well. My initial thought was, "Oh hell, if they stick with this zone, no way we're going to win this game." Mick had some crazy player combinations in there initially to attack it, but to his credit, he eventually found the right one and he struck gold!
Lastly, the biggest thing I took away from last night was about Mick himself. I've always found fault with the timing of his substitutions, and the wierd times that he would substitute for players who were hot and on a roll. Last night, he stuck with the hot lineup, and I loved that. I really wanted him to get Morman and Johnson back in there, but he stuck with Caupain and Cobb and rode them to a nice victory. That was good coaching!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you're going to post, try to post the truth. I've posted that I like the roster, that the recent recruiting has been better, that this team will make the tournament. Unlike most of you, I post all my feelings, whether they are good, or bad, which is exactly what I did when Huggs was here and I thought our offense sucked with him as well. A lot of you are afraid to say a single bad thing about Cronin. Even the Duke fans find fault at times with Mike Krzyzewski, and the Kansas fans with Self, but at Bearcattalk, it's only one single person who can find a fault with Mick. The man is very near perfection. It would be very comical if we could revisit the posts from about 8 years ago from these very same people and what the expectations were back then. Quite a different picture than what we are now reading.

 

[Mcginnjw]

My post after the Morehead game....

Clark reminds me of another player who was an incredible bust in our program. He has no offensive game. He looks slow. He looks timid. I hate it when we recruit these type of players. That damn "bust" of a player coincidently was from North carolina also. His name was Eric Hicks. He even ended up quitting the team for a brief period as a freshman and only averaged 2 points per game. Everyone was highly disappointed with him too. Looks like we've probably got another one of those types of players with Clark.

As to whether or not Cobb will play like that in the future, when we recruited another unknown JC transfer named Nick Van Exel, we all had the same disbelief that he could sustain the first performance we saw that was amazing. Momentum and confidence are an amazing thing. That young man came alive last night and reminded me of the first time I was amazed by Nick Van Exel at about this same point in his first season with us. I'm going to choose to believe that last night was the real Farad Cobb and if it is, he may be the missing piece to this puzzle.....a real shooter finally.

I actually thought we looked rather good against the zone...not at first...but when Mick got the right players in there, we attacked it well. My initial thought was, "Oh hell, if they stick with this zone, no way we're going to win this game." Mick had some crazy player combinations in there initially to attack it, but to his credit, he eventually found the right one and he struck gold!
Lastly, the biggest thing I took away from last night was about Mick himself. I've always found fault with the timing of his substitutions, and the wierd times that he would substitute for players who were hot and on a roll. Last night, he stuck with the hot lineup, and I loved that. I really wanted him to get Morman and Johnson back in there, but he stuck with Caupain and Cobb and rode them to a nice victory. That was good coaching!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you're going to post, try to post the truth. I've posted that I like the roster, that the recent recruiting has been better, that this team will make the tournament. Unlike most of you, I post all my feelings, whether they are good, or bad, which is exactly what I did when Huggs was here and I thought our offense sucked with him as well. A lot of you are afraid to say a single bad thing about Cronin. Even the Duke fans find fault at times with Mike Krzyzewski, and the Kansas fans with Self, but at Bearcattalk, it's only one single person who can find a fault with Mick. The man is very near perfection. It would be very comical if we could revisit the posts from about 8 years ago from these very same people and what the expectations were back then. Quite a different picture than what we are now reading.

Funny you made the comparison of Cobb to Van Exel....after the game I was thinking how great it would be if he turned out to be a steal like Van Exel!! That game and his post game interview reminded me of Van Exel...

 

[L-T]

Funny you made the comparison of Cobb to Van Exel....after the game I was thinking how great it would be if he turned out to be a steal like Van Exel!! That game and his post game interview reminded me of Van Exel...

We recruited Van Exel very late that year, with very little fanfare. What a diamond in the rough Nick turned out to be. Farad made an impressive statement in that game and I was praying that Mick would come right back with him the next game, but he didn't. I sure hope that game was more representative of how good he will be. It might be the single thing that makes the difference with this team.

 

[BC21]

Good stuff!

 

[TheLongHaul]

It is a very common strategy in both college and the NBA. You bring the offensive spark of the bench to pick up the starters if they struggle to score.

Once again you are missing my point. You don't keep one of your best players out of the lineup because you want him to be a backup. And even comparing college and NBA is dumb, two completely different games.

 

[TheLongHaul]

I do. 75 points is more exciting, higher tempo, better atmosphere. More enjoyable game than 20 bricks going up over and over, easier to convince small time fans to repeat visits, more exposure, need I go on?

Forgot one major point: recruiting. Mick's recruiting has been very mediocre and I have to believe style of play has something to do with that.

 

[TheLongHaul]

Can we stop confusing good offense with total points per game rankings.

The offense is terrible this year and has not been good enough to win a title in his tenure. But our ppg rankings will always be awful because we play at a stupidly slow tempo.

Honest question because I don't know the answer: what has UC's offensive ratings been over the course of the past 5 or so years?

 

[BCM]

Forgot one major point: recruiting. Mick's recruiting has been very mediocre and I have to believe style of play has something to do with that.

True, true.

 

[mdchick]

Honest question because I don't know the answer: what has UC's offensive ratings been over the course of the past 5 or so years?

4 straight ncaa tourney appearances and a sweet 16

 

[TheLongHaul]

4 straight ncaa tourney appearances and a sweet 16

great....not what I asked.

 

[Bearcat_NTS]

Honest question because I don't know the answer: what has UC's offensive ratings been over the course of the past 5 or so years?

Per KenPom-
2014-15 (thus far): 98.9 (163)
2013-14: 107.8 (110)
2012-13: 103.2 (126)
2011-12: 107.7 (61)
2010-11: 109.0 (53)
2009-10: 103.9 (128)

The number is points per 100 possessions.

 

[bearcat jeff]

My post after the Morehead game....

Clark reminds me of another player who was an incredible bust in our program. He has no offensive game. He looks slow. He looks timid. I hate it when we recruit these type of players. That damn "bust" of a player coincidently was from North carolina also. His name was Eric Hicks. He even ended up quitting the team for a brief period as a freshman and only averaged 2 points per game. Everyone was highly disappointed with him too. Looks like we've probably got another one of those types of players with Clark.

As to whether or not Cobb will play like that in the future, when we recruited another unknown JC transfer named Nick Van Exel, we all had the same disbelief that he could sustain the first performance we saw that was amazing. Momentum and confidence are an amazing thing. That young man came alive last night and reminded me of the first time I was amazed by Nick Van Exel at about this same point in his first season with us. I'm going to choose to believe that last night was the real Farad Cobb and if it is, he may be the missing piece to this puzzle.....a real shooter finally.

I actually thought we looked rather good against the zone...not at first...but when Mick got the right players in there, we attacked it well. My initial thought was, "Oh hell, if they stick with this zone, no way we're going to win this game." Mick had some crazy player combinations in there initially to attack it, but to his credit, he eventually found the right one and he struck gold!
Lastly, the biggest thing I took away from last night was about Mick himself. I've always found fault with the timing of his substitutions, and the wierd times that he would substitute for players who were hot and on a roll. Last night, he stuck with the hot lineup, and I loved that. I really wanted him to get Morman and Johnson back in there, but he stuck with Caupain and Cobb and rode them to a nice victory. That was good coaching!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you're going to post, try to post the truth. I've posted that I like the roster, that the recent recruiting has been better, that this team will make the tournament. Unlike most of you, I post all my feelings, whether they are good, or bad, which is exactly what I did when Huggs was here and I thought our offense sucked with him as well. A lot of you are afraid to say a single bad thing about Cronin. Even the Duke fans find fault at times with Mike Krzyzewski, and the Kansas fans with Self, but at Bearcattalk, it's only one single person who can find a fault with Mick. The man is very near perfection. It would be very comical if we could revisit the posts from about 8 years ago from these very same people and what the expectations were back then. Quite a different picture than what we are now reading.

You over sensationalize things. Some posts remind me of the guy who tells his woman, "That's a pretty dress but your ass looks fat." You aren't the only person critical of Mick Cronin that's simply untrue. But I know you're a huge Bearcat fan and you do make some valid points that get lost sometimes.

Mick is obviously a more talented game planner and defensive coach than an offensive one. Offense looks better when players make shots and yes that can be brought back to recruiting but that circles back to coaching philosophy and His philosophy is a defensive one.

Some people, myself included believe we know who should play and how but the fact is we are operation managers, engineers, lawyers, auto-workers and students. Mick Cronin is a D1 college basketball coach and a successful one. He sees the players in practice and knows what they can and can't do and how it fits into what he wants to accomplish better than any of us.

We worry about style and he worries about winning and getting better. His is a philosophy that has won 101 games the past four years, 4 straight ncaa trips, a BEast tournament final, been to a sweet 16 and won a league championship. It's fun to debate and think we know what should be, but the reality is I wouldn't pretend to assume I know better than him what it takes to win.

 

[TheLongHaul]

Per KenPom-
2014-15 (thus far): 98.9 (163)
2013-14: 107.8 (110)
2012-13: 103.2 (126)
2011-12: 107.7 (61)
2010-11: 109.0 (53)
2009-10: 103.9 (128)

The number is points per 100 possessions.

So the quoted numbers are the rankings? If so, those are putrid numbers. Ervin made is seem like they had good years offensively, but in their best year they didn't even crack top 50.

 

[#BearcatNation]

Per KenPom-
2014-15 (thus far): 98.9 (163)
2013-14: 107.8 (110)
2012-13: 103.2 (126)
2011-12: 107.7 (61)
2010-11: 109.0 (53)
2009-10: 103.9 (128)

The number is points per 100 possessions.

I find it very interesting that last year, we scored more points per possession than in 11-12, but went from 61st to 110th. I guess other teams are getting much more efficient with the ball.

 

[ME80]

My post after the Morehead game....

Clark reminds me of another player who was an incredible bust in our program. He has no offensive game. He looks slow. He looks timid. I hate it when we recruit these type of players. That damn "bust" of a player coincidently was from North carolina also. His name was Eric Hicks. He even ended up quitting the team for a brief period as a freshman and only averaged 2 points per game. Everyone was highly disappointed with him too. Looks like we've probably got another one of those types of players with Clark.

As to whether or not Cobb will play like that in the future, when we recruited another unknown JC transfer named Nick Van Exel, we all had the same disbelief that he could sustain the first performance we saw that was amazing. Momentum and confidence are an amazing thing. That young man came alive last night and reminded me of the first time I was amazed by Nick Van Exel at about this same point in his first season with us. I'm going to choose to believe that last night was the real Farad Cobb and if it is, he may be the missing piece to this puzzle.....a real shooter finally.

I actually thought we looked rather good against the zone...not at first...but when Mick got the right players in there, we attacked it well. My initial thought was, "Oh hell, if they stick with this zone, no way we're going to win this game." Mick had some crazy player combinations in there initially to attack it, but to his credit, he eventually found the right one and he struck gold!
Lastly, the biggest thing I took away from last night was about Mick himself. I've always found fault with the timing of his substitutions, and the wierd times that he would substitute for players who were hot and on a roll. Last night, he stuck with the hot lineup, and I loved that. I really wanted him to get Morman and Johnson back in there, but he stuck with Caupain and Cobb and rode them to a nice victory. That was good coaching!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If you're going to post, try to post the truth. I've posted that I like the roster, that the recent recruiting has been better, that this team will make the tournament. Unlike most of you, I post all my feelings, whether they are good, or bad, which is exactly what I did when Huggs was here and I thought our offense sucked with him as well. A lot of you are afraid to say a single bad thing about Cronin. Even the Duke fans find fault at times with Mike Krzyzewski, and the Kansas fans with Self, but at Bearcattalk, it's only one single person who can find a fault with Mick. The man is very near perfection. It would be very comical if we could revisit the posts from about 8 years ago from these very same people and what the expectations were back then. Quite a different picture than what we are now reading.

L-T, first of all I never said that you never post a positive remark. I did post the truth in that in only takes a small crack for you to go back to bringing up the same old things. It happens constantly. And by the way, I saw your positive quote about the game last night. Even though the score was close and our offense still stuttered at times I think we both saw some improvement.

 

[L-T]

L-T, first of all I never said that you never post a positive remark. I did post the truth in that in only takes a small crack for you to go back to bringing up the same old things. It happens constantly. And by the way, I saw your positive quote about the game last night. Even though the score was close and our offense still stuttered at times I think we both saw some improvement.

Unlike the vast majority in here, I have no problem posting positive thoughts as well as negative thoughts. If this forum was anywhere near how our core fanbase thinks, the Shoe would be standing room only. I support coach Cronin where it counts. I contribute to UCATS every year and buy my tickets every year. I support him at some road games and at all tournaments. If I want to complain or question his coaching, I've earned that right. If I truly hated him, I would just quit getting my tickets and write a letter to President Ono, the BOT, and the AD bashing him as my reason for leaving the program. A season ticket holder with my longevity would raise some eyebrows if I suddenly call it quits. Additionally, my support of this university stretches far wider than just buying basketball tickets, but I'm not going to go into all that. The point is, I support Coach Cronin, but I feel he needs to do better. In the business world, I get judged the same way. My bosses demand continuous improvement and they don't always like things I do...and they tell me so. Mick's skin is thick. It has to be to coach college basketball. Complaining fans on a forum are the least of his worries. Just like many of you have posted..."Just win baby"! Mick would probably say, "Just buy tickets baby"! He could care less about what I bitch about on here as long as I'm buying tickets and attending games.

 

[bearcat jeff]

L-T I'm guessing you're right.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Unlike the vast majority in here, I have no problem posting positive thoughts as well as negative thoughts. If this forum was anywhere near how our core fanbase thinks, the Shoe would be standing room only. I support coach Cronin where it counts. I contribute to UCATS every year and buy my tickets every year. I support him at some road games and at all tournaments. If I want to complain or question his coaching, I've earned that right. If I truly hated him, I would just quit getting my tickets and write a letter to President Ono, the BOT, and the AD bashing him as my reason for leaving the program. A season ticket holder with my longevity would raise some eyebrows if I suddenly call it quits. Additionally, my support of this university stretches far wider than just buying basketball tickets, but I'm not going to go into all that. The point is, I support Coach Cronin, but I feel he needs to do better. In the business world, I get judged the same way. My bosses demand continuous improvement and they don't always like things I do...and they tell me so. Mick's skin is thick. It has to be to coach college basketball. Complaining fans on a forum are the least of his worries. Just like many of you have posted..."Just win baby"! Mick would probably say, "Just buy tickets baby"! He could care less about what I bitch about on here as long as I'm buying tickets and attending games.

I feel the same way Mick Does about You.

 

[ervins84]

I find it very interesting that last year, we scored more points per possession than in 11-12, but went from 61st to 110th. I guess other teams are getting much more efficient with the ball.

No real proof of this but my best guess is it might have been a result of the rules changes (charge rule, freedom of movement etc) which resulted in more ftas and higher efficiency. I don't know if the data supports this theory though

 

[ervins84]

So the quoted numbers are the rankings? If so, those are putrid numbers. Ervin made is seem like they had good years offensively, but in their best year they didn't even crack top 50.

I'd have screenshotted the data at the time of my original post but couldnt get it to upload for some reason from my phone.

Wasnt trying to mislead at all. My point was simply that our offense sucks this year, we've never had a championship caliber offense in his tenure, and that ppg rankings are useless in evaluating performance. Ppg will always make his teams look worse offensively. Trust me I wish he'd start hanging out with Dave Rose or Mike Anderson in the off-season, but until then we'll never be rated highly in ppg.

I mean one of the posts itt referenced Florida not having a good offense last year despite being top 25.