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2015-2016 Season
- Thread starter jacobkdoyle
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TrillCosby
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I'm trying go big with pro style line up.
Jenifer
Caupain
Clark
Ellis
Deberry
You'll definitely see Ellis and Deberry in at the same time sometimes this year, but no way we see Clark at the 3. I could see Shaq getting some minutes at the 4 this year if Cronin doesn't feel comfortable with any back ups for Clark.
Is it possible that Shaq plays the 4 in a small lineup, with Evans at the 3? Quadri doesn't seem like he's ready to contribute at a high level yet, and Scott is just a FR. If we go small, or if Clark gets fouls, I wonder if we would ever see this.
I was thinking deberry could sub in for Ellis and Clark and when we have Ellis and deberry in the game together we can just play a 2-3 zone
Bearcat_NTS
Well-known member
Nope. Never will happen even for a second in any meaningful game.I'm trying go big with pro style line up.
Jenifer
Caupain
Clark
Ellis
Deberry
Nope. Never will happen even for a second in any meaningful game.
Mick isn't dumb. He knows what it takes to win. Lyles played SF on Ky for us you guys because he's 6'10 automatically put him as C. Clark wants to go pro he has man up and play the 3. Shaq can't shoot worth shit from 3 so please don't say Clark can't shoot.
Ellis is a pro PF. He can defend 1-5 on switch he doesn't need zone protectionI was thinking deberry could sub in for Ellis and Clark and when we have Ellis and deberry in the game together we can just play a 2-3 zone
You have to look at both sides of the ball. If you give up more points on D than you can create on offense...you aren't going to get the lion's share of the minutes.
Look at DeBerry. Per 40 minutes he had the highest scoring rate on the team. But he was out of shape and not nearly as mobile on D as were Ellis and Clark. If you look at the box plus minus stats (which is a combination of O and D) they aren't even close. Ellis and Clark had a much higher rating even though they didn't score points as fast as DeBerry.
I don't care how good on offense Jenifer is...he's going to have to play D very well and not turn the ball over. it's probably going to take him some time to learn the speed of the game.
We can't just look at things from the offensive side of the ball...it's only 50% of the game.
Look at DeBerry. Per 40 minutes he had the highest scoring rate on the team. But he was out of shape and not nearly as mobile on D as were Ellis and Clark. If you look at the box plus minus stats (which is a combination of O and D) they aren't even close. Ellis and Clark had a much higher rating even though they didn't score points as fast as DeBerry.
I don't care how good on offense Jenifer is...he's going to have to play D very well and not turn the ball over. it's probably going to take him some time to learn the speed of the game.
We can't just look at things from the offensive side of the ball...it's only 50% of the game.
jacobkdoyle
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- 17,008
You have to look at both sides of the ball. If you give up more points on D than you can create on offense...you aren't going to get the lion's share of the minutes.
Look at DeBerry. Per 40 minutes he had the highest scoring rate on the team. But he was out of shape and not nearly as mobile on D as were Ellis and Clark. If you look at the box plus minus stats (which is a combination of O and D) they aren't even close. Ellis and Clark had a much higher rating even though they didn't score points as fast as DeBerry.
I don't care how good on offense Jenifer is...he's going to have to play D very well and not turn the ball over. it's probably going to take him some time to learn the speed of the game.
We can't just look at things from the offensive side of the ball...it's only 50% of the game.
If we play zone, I'm not that worried about Jenifer on D. Just don't get beat on 3s.
Ellis, KJ and Shaq turned ball over at alarming rates and still got tons of PT. Don't know where u got your info.You have to look at both sides of the ball. If you give up more points on D than you can create on offense...you aren't going to get the lion's share of the minutes.
Look at DeBerry. Per 40 minutes he had the highest scoring rate on the team. But he was out of shape and not nearly as mobile on D as were Ellis and Clark. If you look at the box plus minus stats (which is a combination of O and D) they aren't even close. Ellis and Clark had a much higher rating even though they didn't score points as fast as DeBerry.
I don't care how good on offense Jenifer is...he's going to have to play D very well and not turn the ball over. it's probably going to take him some time to learn the speed of the game.
We can't just look at things from the offensive side of the ball...it's only 50% of the game.
If we play zone, I'm not that worried about Jenifer on D. Just don't get beat on 3s.
Jenifer probably has quickest hands on team. He's from inner city Baltimore so NOBODY just go bully him. Watch how he takes it to Tc for his starting spot.
You have to look at both sides of the ball. If you give up more points on D than you can create on offense...you aren't going to get the lion's share of the minutes.
Look at DeBerry. Per 40 minutes he had the highest scoring rate on the team. But he was out of shape and not nearly as mobile on D as were Ellis and Clark. If you look at the box plus minus stats (which is a combination of O and D) they aren't even close. Ellis and Clark had a much higher rating even though they didn't score points as fast as DeBerry.
I don't care how good on offense Jenifer is...he's going to have to play D very well and not turn the ball over. it's probably going to take him some time to learn the speed of the game.
We can't just look at things from the offensive side of the ball...it's only 50% of the game.
Everyone is just assuming that Jenifer can't play defense. I've never been a big fan of Caupain's defense either. In the scrimmage, I specifically watched Jenifer's defense and he looked pretty good. It was a small sample size, but again, for a young player, he looked like he was very capable and with good coaching, could hold his own and possibly be very good.
As someone else mentioned, I'm not saying to bench Caupain when you play Jenifer. The strength in this team in my opinion is the number of interchangeable parts. There are times we can go with a three guard offense. There are ways to get this kid involved and to get him more minutes than some piddly amount.
I fully understand that I could be 100% wrong on Jenifer and that his performance on Saturday was just in a scrimmage that meant nothing. I don't think I'm wrong though, but I'll certainly change my thoughts if he proves me wrong. I'm hoping he proves me right.
What position was Tc go start if guyn didn't quit?Everyone is just assuming that Jenifer can't play defense. I've never been a big fan of Caupain's defense either. In the scrimmage, I specifically watched Jenifer's defense and he looked pretty good. It was a small sample size, but again, for a young player, he looked like he was very capable and with good coaching, could hold his own and possibly be very good.
As someone else mentioned, I'm not saying to bench Caupain when you play Jenifer. The strength in this team in my opinion is the number of interchangeable parts. There are times we can go with a three guard offense. There are ways to get this kid involved and to get him more minutes than some piddly amount.
I fully understand that I could be 100% wrong on Jenifer and that his performance on Saturday was just in a scrimmage that meant nothing. I don't think I'm wrong though, but I'll certainly change my thoughts if he proves me wrong. I'm hoping he proves me right.
Everyone is just assuming that Jenifer can't play defense. I've never been a big fan of Caupain's defense either. In the scrimmage, I specifically watched Jenifer's defense and he looked pretty good. It was a small sample size, but again, for a young player, he looked like he was very capable and with good coaching, could hold his own and possibly be very good.
As someone else mentioned, I'm not saying to bench Caupain when you play Jenifer. The strength in this team in my opinion is the number of interchangeable parts. There are times we can go with a three guard offense. There are ways to get this kid involved and to get him more minutes than some piddly amount.
I fully understand that I could be 100% wrong on Jenifer and that his performance on Saturday was just in a scrimmage that meant nothing. I don't think I'm wrong though, but I'll certainly change my thoughts if he proves me wrong. I'm hoping he proves me right.
I don't assume his defense is poor. People just keep talking about his offensive skills with little regard to what Cronin really cares deeply about. JJ has to learn and understand the Bearcat defensive scheme, adjust to the speed of D1 BB, as well as have the ability to perform the defensive duties and usually that takes some time for frosh.
But all frosh are different
I don't assume his defense is poor. People just keep talking about his offensive skills with little regard to what Cronin really cares deeply about. JJ has to learn and understand the Bearcat defensive scheme, adjust to the speed of D1 BB, as well as have the ability to perform the defensive duties and usually that takes some time for frosh.
But all frosh are different
Cronin has been preaching assists all year. Time off let him know what it takes to win. You can play 40 minutes of hell defense if you can't make laying ups it's all irrelevant
I do believe I read where Mick did in fact have a revelation during his down time and has changed his thoughts on recruiting good shooters and becoming more offensive-minded in his recruiting. We'll see how his new way of thinking plays on this talented roster that we have.
justinhub2003
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- 5,583
I'm trying go big with pro style line up.
Jenifer
Caupain
Clark
Ellis
Deberry
If we start this lineup one of our main advantages goes away: Depth
I mean, Kentucky won 38 straight because of talents But also because of there depth. No one could play with them for 40 minutes who didn't have depth.
The Lineup needs to be:
Caupain
Cobb
Shaq
Clark
Ellis
With
Jenifer subbing in for PG
KJ For SG
Evans for SF
Tre Scott/moore for PF
Deberry for your center.
Sure, against certain teams, you may have to go big but you can't do it for more than a few minute stretches.
Im not saying they should run a platoon system but a Game is 40 minutes long and I know Deberry did put in work to get better stamina and so did clark and ellis. But no need to play them all that the same time.
If we start this lineup one of our main advantages goes away: Depth
I mean, Kentucky won 38 straight because of talents But also because of there depth. No one could play with them for 40 minutes who didn't have depth.
The Lineup needs to be:
Caupain
Cobb
Shaq
Clark
Ellis
With
Jenifer subbing in for PG
KJ For SG
Evans for SF
Tre Scott/moore for PF
Deberry for your center.
Sure, against certain teams, you may have to go big but you can't do it for more than a few minute stretches.
Im not saying they should run a platoon system but a Game is 40 minutes long and I know Deberry did put in work to get better stamina and so did clark and ellis. But no need to play them all that the same time.
Deberry in lineup takes away depth? He could play in 6 minutes spurts and be fine
justinhub2003
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Deberry in lineup takes away depth? He could play in 6 minutes spurts and be fine
What's the advantage of starting him?
I'd rather not have him gassed by the end of the game in case of foul trouble.
Ifd rather not ever have to see Ellis , deberry and Clark all on the bench resting at the same time
cincrulz11
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I'm trying go big with pro style line up.
Jenifer
Caupain
Clark
Ellis
Deberry
Could you imagine defending this group? Each team would play a zone with 5 guys in the paint and say good luck. Our spacing is already terrible. Imagine what that group would do to it.
jacobkdoyle
Well-known member
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- Mar 23, 2014
- Messages
- 17,008
Troy averaged 9.6 ppg 3.6 rpg and 3.6 apg last year in 31.3 minutes. I'm hoping he averages less minutes this year, simply bc I don't think we'll have to grind through some of our non-con games like we did last year. But I don't see any reason why we shouldn't expect 12.5 ppg 4 rpg and 4.5 apg from him. We can debate about him as a PG all day, but regardless of any of that, he's one of the most well-rounded players in the league. And he can get those numbers with good shooting %s and limited TO.