2017 General Recruiting

[jacobkdoyle]

What are "these kind of players"? Guys who aren't ranked super high with a full senior year left?

Yeah. Or guys who aren't ranked at all. Recruiting rankings aren't everything, I know that (although people are awfully quick to point to them when discussing this year's team). But it's part of the excitement of following a college program. As Jack said, it always has to be the little engine that could. It's just hard to get really excited about UC basketball anymore bc I feel like there always has to be a disclaimer. This guy wasn't ranked high, but the coaches know they got a gem even though everyone else missed him. Our games aren't particularly fun to watch, but we do things differently and get into the field. We aren't ranked in the polls, but we actually like it better that way. We don't win conference championships, get good seeds, win (really any) conference tournament games, and don't advance in March, but it's bc we're an outsider in the league and the refs had it out for us. Just get old having to try so hard to explain away deficiencies. At the beginning of Cronin's tenure it seemed like we brought in better recruits, without having the success to match bc he was building from scratch. That was impressive. But now after 6 straight tournaments, somehow we land guys who the recruiting services don't even have pages for. Again, they aren't the end all...but it just doesn't even feel like we're part of the sport at times. We try so hard to be different in every aspect of the approach, I'd just kill to have a nice, normal program to follow. Maybe that means I expect too much, but I have a hard time believing Cronin couldn't get Moore and Nsoseme to Murray State. Doesn't mean they aren't good players. Doesn't even necessarily mean I think they are unworthy of scholarships, but our results and approach just always leave so much to be desired. We almost go out of our way to ensure that we don't have anything high-end. It's a characteristic of the coach. He deserves credit for what he's built, but as we've seen, even the most loyal supporters are beginning to question if he's taken us as far as he can.

 

[TrillCosby]

Yeah. Or guys who aren't ranked at all. Recruiting rankings aren't everything, I know that (although people are awfully quick to point to them when discussing this year's team). But it's part of the excitement of following a college program. As Jack said, it always has to be the little engine that could. It's just hard to get really excited about UC basketball anymore bc I feel like there always has to be a disclaimer. This guy wasn't ranked high, but the coaches know they got a gem even though everyone else missed him. Our games aren't particularly fun to watch, but we do things differently and get into the field. We aren't ranked in the polls, but we actually like it better that way. We don't win conference championships, get good seeds, win (really any) conference tournament games, and don't advance in March, but it's bc we're an outsider in the league and the refs had it out for us. Just get old having to try so hard to explain away deficiencies. At the beginning of Cronin's tenure it seemed like we brought in better recruits, without having the success to match bc he was building from scratch. That was impressive. But now after 6 straight tournaments, somehow we land guys who the recruiting services don't even have pages for. Again, they aren't the end all...but it just doesn't even feel like we're part of the sport at times. We try so hard to be different in every aspect of the approach, I'd just kill to have a nice, normal program to follow. Maybe that means I expect too much, but I have a hard time believing Cronin couldn't get Moore and Nsoseme to Murray State. Doesn't mean they aren't good players. Doesn't even necessarily mean I think they are unworthy of scholarships, but our results and approach just always leave so much to be desired. We almost go out of our way to ensure that we don't have anything high-end. It's a characteristic of the coach. He deserves credit for what he's built, but as we've seen, even the most loyal supporters are beginning to question if he's taken us as far as he can.

This will be the year to find out, there's plenty of talent and/or experience that there is no reason this team shouldn't make it to the 2nd weekend of the tournament.

I think Cronin isn't into recruiting the best players because you might not always land them and you might end up with a depleted or unbalanced roster.
Right now it seems he wants at least one stud per year(Clark, Evans, Cumberland), while adding players who know there role on the team and will do whatever it takes to win(Brooks, Scott, Nsoseme).

All I know was Nsoseme was at the top of their board at C and a shooter with size was a must in this class, which we got with Moore.

Recruiting rankings are for the fans honestly and I do agree it would be nice to have those top 100 players every year to build a little bit of hype heading into the season.

 

[2bearcatdad]

Some good discussion here. I think the last several posts sum it up nicely. A lot of us give Cronin credit for getting the program stabilized and attaining some level of success, but most of us believe that he needs to get the program to take the next step in the form of more post season success. I believe the teams have the talent to be successful over the next couple of years - now it's time have that translate to more success on the court. If these teams can make a sweet 16 or better run, then we'll feel somewhat justified for our defense of him. If not, I think more and more of us will start to join those who think a change in leadership will be necessary to get us over that hump.

I'm optimistic about this year's team, but I thought we would be better than we were last year also. For me, Octavius was the biggest disappointment last year. I really felt like he would be in the running for AAC POY last year. He performed so far below that level it was hard to rationalize. That was the biggest difference between the season that I expected and what we actually achieved in my mind.

I can't wait to see what this team looks like when the season starts.

Go Cats!

 

[GarradJ21]

Some good discussion here. I think the last several posts sum it up nicely. A lot of us give Cronin credit for getting the program stabilized and attaining some level of success, but most of us believe that he needs to get the program to take the next step in the form of more post season success. I believe the teams have the talent to be successful over the next couple of years - now it's time have that translate to more success on the court. If these teams can make a sweet 16 or better run, then we'll feel somewhat justified for our defense of him. If not, I think more and more of us will start to join those who think a change in leadership will be necessary to get us over that hump.

I'm optimistic about this year's team, but I thought we would be better than we were last year also. For me, Octavius was the biggest disappointment last year. I really felt like he would be in the running for AAC POY last year. He performed so far below that level it was hard to rationalize. That was the biggest difference between the season that I expected and what we actually achieved in my mind.

I can't wait to see what this team looks like when the season starts.

Go Cats!

I agree with everything you stated. This year we would have to believe is going to be great, but I guess we are all worried because we felt the same about last year. Realistically, like you said Ellis was a bust, Cobb didn't show up late when we needed him to hit 3s. Once in awhile but not consistently (One against UConn late in the 2nd half and one against St Joes late in the 2nd half that's really it) Shaq was typical Shaq and unfortunately got injured when he started playing a little better, then we can probably all agree our favorite ended up being Deberry. I realize now that senior class wasn't all that great as we thought it was going to be when we started the year.

Overall a lot of talent and weaker bench but still should able to get us in one of the best seeds we have had under Cronin and hopefully a sweet 16 run or better. I'm very optimistic on Cronin, but this year is pretty much make or break year for coach.

 

[DSquare]

This will be the year to find out, there's plenty of talent and/or experience that there is no reason this team shouldn't make it to the 2nd weekend of the tournament.

I think Cronin isn't into recruiting the best players because you might not always land them and you might end up with a depleted or unbalanced roster.
Right now it seems he wants at least one stud per year(Clark, Evans, Cumberland), while adding players who know there role on the team and will do whatever it takes to win(Brooks, Scott, Nsoseme).

All I know was Nsoseme was at the top of their board at C and a shooter with size was a must in this class, which we got with Moore.

Recruiting rankings are for the fans honestly and I do agree it would be nice to have those top 100 players every year to build a little bit of hype heading into the season.

Hopefully they have a very good feel for Nsoseme's eligibility situation. The foreign guys are always tricky, and i would hate to see it go down to the last minute. You have to trust the coaches on this, but you hate to ink a guy and find out a year later it was a bust.

 

[CrakkerBarrellsX]

How do you know? Did you watch and scout them, or just google their names looking for rankings?

It's too early for me to be jolly or upset about this class. Would I like to see us landing guys in the Top 100? Of course; don't be silly. That just seems like a pretty harsh comment when I can't imagine you've even seen either one of our commits play in-person. Give it time before you decide that these guys are "nothing special".

Whats point of top 100 if you need to see them play first anyway?

 

[#BearcatNation]

Whats point of top 100 if you need to see them play first anyway?

You're completely missing the point. I had a problem with him saying the players were "nothing special". Not fair at all to say that.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

You can debate Moore and Nsoseme, but the majority of our recruits get legitimate high-major offers.

Here's the list based on 247

Caupain - UC, Missouri, South Carolina
Johnson - UC, Cornell, Dayton, DePaul, Minnesota, Ohio, Seton Hall, Toledo
Clark - UC, Charlotte, Clemson, ECU, Maryland, Miami, NC State, Old Dominion, Ole Miss, Pitt, Richmond, UNC Greensboro, UNC Wilmington, VCU, Wake Forest
Moore - UC, Auburn, Georgetown, Iowa State, Marquette, Miami, Providence, Purdue, Rutgers, Seton Hall, St. Joe's, Temple, Wake Forest
Washington - UC and Marquette were the main ones when he transferred I think?
Broome - UC and Creighton were the main ones when he transferred I think?
Evans - UC, Auburn, Baylor, Houston, Louisiana Tech, South Carolina, Tulane, UTEP, Western Kentucky (can't believe they didn't get him lol)
Jenifer - UC, Georgetown, Memphis, Miami, Penn State, Rutgers, South Forida
Scott - UC, Alabama, Clemson, Florida Atlantic, Georgia, UAB
Cumberland - UC, Florida State, Purdue, Xavier
Brooks - UC, Seton Hall, South Carolina, St. John's
Moore - UC, Illinois State, Murray State, Old Dominion, SFA
Nsoseme - someone on Twitter mentioned New Mexico and St. Bonaventure

 

[coachpipe]

Here's the list based on 247

Caupain - UC, Missouri, South Carolina
Johnson - UC, Cornell, Dayton, DePaul, Minnesota, Ohio, Seton Hall, Toledo
Clark - UC, Charlotte, Clemson, ECU, Maryland, Miami, NC State, Old Dominion, Ole Miss, Pitt, Richmond, UNC Greensboro, UNC Wilmington, VCU, Wake Forest
Moore - UC, Auburn, Georgetown, Iowa State, Marquette, Miami, Providence, Purdue, Rutgers, Seton Hall, St. Joe's, Temple, Wake Forest
Washington - UC and Marquette were the main ones when he transferred I think?
Broome - UC and Creighton were the main ones when he transferred I think?
Evans - UC, Auburn, Baylor, Houston, Louisiana Tech, South Carolina, Tulane, UTEP, Western Kentucky (can't believe they didn't get him lol)
Jenifer - UC, Georgetown, Memphis, Miami, Penn State, Rutgers, South Forida
Scott - UC, Alabama, Clemson, Florida Atlantic, Georgia, UAB
Cumberland - UC, Florida State, Purdue, Xavier
Brooks - UC, Seton Hall, South Carolina, St. John's
Moore - UC, Illinois State, Murray State, Old Dominion, SFA
Nsoseme - someone on Twitter mentioned New Mexico and St. Bonaventure

The sites dont always list all the offers. Like Troy for instance. Virginia Tech and Virginia offered
Cumberland also had offers Iowa State, West Virginia, Butler and Michigan. And after he committed last year he was posting pictures of letters from Kansas trying to pry him away

 

[#BearcatNation]

Here's the list based on 247

Caupain - UC, Missouri, South Carolina
Johnson - UC, Cornell, Dayton, DePaul, Minnesota, Ohio, Seton Hall, Toledo - Xavier offered
Clark - UC, Charlotte, Clemson, ECU, Maryland, Miami, NC State, Old Dominion, Ole Miss, Pitt, Richmond, UNC Greensboro, UNC Wilmington, VCU, Wake Forest
Moore - UC, Auburn, Georgetown, Iowa State, Marquette, Miami, Providence, Purdue, Rutgers, Seton Hall, St. Joe's, Temple, Wake Forest
Washington - UC and Marquette were the main ones when he transferred I think? - There were like 15 high-major schools that went after him.
Broome - UC and Creighton were the main ones when he transferred I think?- There were like 10 high-major schools that went after him.
Evans - UC, Auburn, Baylor, Houston, Louisiana Tech, South Carolina, Tulane, UTEP, Western Kentucky (can't believe they didn't get him lol)
Jenifer - UC, Georgetown, Memphis, Miami, Penn State, Rutgers, South Forida
Scott - UC, Alabama, Clemson, Florida Atlantic, Georgia, UAB
Cumberland - UC, Florida State, Purdue, Xavier He definitely had more than this...was getting mail from Kansas constantly after he committed to UC
Brooks - UC, Seton Hall, South Carolina, St. John's - Xavier offered
Moore - UC, Illinois State, Murray State, Old Dominion, SFA
Nsoseme - someone on Twitter mentioned New Mexico and St. Bonaventure - Valpo offered

Added some corrections that were simply off the top of my head. Like coachpipe said, these sites do not update as well as they should.

 

[justinhub2003]

Here's the list based on 247

Caupain - UC, Missouri, South Carolina
Johnson - UC, Cornell, Dayton, DePaul, Minnesota, Ohio, Seton Hall, Toledo
Clark - UC, Charlotte, Clemson, ECU, Maryland, Miami, NC State, Old Dominion, Ole Miss, Pitt, Richmond, UNC Greensboro, UNC Wilmington, VCU, Wake Forest
Moore - UC, Auburn, Georgetown, Iowa State, Marquette, Miami, Providence, Purdue, Rutgers, Seton Hall, St. Joe's, Temple, Wake Forest
Washington - UC and Marquette were the main ones when he transferred I think?
Broome - UC and Creighton were the main ones when he transferred I think?
Evans - UC, Auburn, Baylor, Houston, Louisiana Tech, South Carolina, Tulane, UTEP, Western Kentucky (can't believe they didn't get him lol)
Jenifer - UC, Georgetown, Memphis, Miami, Penn State, Rutgers, South Forida
Scott - UC, Alabama, Clemson, Florida Atlantic, Georgia, UAB
Cumberland - UC, Florida State, Purdue, Xavier
Brooks - UC, Seton Hall, South Carolina, St. John's
Moore - UC, Illinois State, Murray State, Old Dominion, SFA
Nsoseme - someone on Twitter mentioned New Mexico and St. Bonaventure

I dunno how accurate it is; but Verbal Commits which tracks info from ESPN.Scout and 247 (i think) has Troy with others from Virginia, Richmond and Virginia Tech

Johnson with offers from: Wisconsin, Xavier, VCU and Butler
Clark with offers from: Miami Fl, Maryland, Wichit st, xavier and others
Washington with offers from: Memphis, OSU, Wiscon, iowa, uconn, baylor, iSU
Scott: offers from Tenn
Cumberland: West virgina, Butler,Michigan
Brooks: Rhode Island, Gtown, Miami Fl, St Joes

 

[jacobkdoyle]

Added some corrections that were simply off the top of my head. Like coachpipe said, these sites do not update as well as they should.

I figured either Cumberland had more, or he narrowed his list quickly. I didn't know Xavier offered Brooks. I didn't know what actual offers Washington and Broome had, I just remember the visits. Thanks for the updates.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

When looking at it all in one list, I think we have done a little better than I would've guessed. Jenifer and Moore were the most surprising to me.

 

[GarradJ21]

All in all some pretty good schools we beat out. Have we beaten out the top tier Kansas duke UK..does epperson have those looks?

 

[TrillCosby]

When looking at it all in one list, I think we have done a little better than I would've guessed. Jenifer and Moore were the most surprising to me.

Both were really highly rated early in their high school years, but we're dropped in the rankings by their senior year.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

All in all some pretty schools we beat out. Have we beaten out the top tier Kansas duke UK..does epperson have those looks?

Cumberland committed pretty early...I'd have to believe he could've gone to Michigan State with Ward if he really wanted to. I also wonder if UNC would've offered Clark at some point during his SR year, had he not already been committed.

 

[TrillCosby]

All in all some pretty schools we beat out. Have we beaten out the top tier Kansas duke UK..does epperson have those looks?

They usually only beat out each other. Epperson has a ton of high majors after him, but I don't know about any blue bloods involved.

 

[justinhub2003]

Very rarely will we ever beat out Blue Bloods schools.

And rightfully so.. We just aren't on their level and even in our hey day 90's, I don't think we could hang with the likes John Calipari, and Coach K.


But I do feel we can get recruits with offers from 3rd tier teams and even some 2nd tier teams. If we move into the Big 12 and get this new arena (big 12 being more important) I think we can compete with every 2nd tier team in the country on recruiting.

Kids want to play in a P5 conference.

 

[justinhub2003]

that said, Verbal commits shows an average of stars for each D1 team.

Here is out we stack up for 2016-17
UC: 3.41 stars
XU: 3.15
West Virginia (King Bob to those stuck in the past): 3.01
Kansas: 3.65
Iowa St: 2.93
Kentucky: 3.66
Louisville: 3.45
UCONN: 3.94



We ranked 25 overall

 

[#BearcatNation]

that said, Verbal commits shows an average of stars for each D1 team.

Here is out we stack up for 2016-17
UC: 3.41 stars
XU: 3.15
West Virginia (King Bob to those stuck in the past): 3.01
Kansas: 3.65
Iowa St: 2.93
Kentucky: 3.66
Louisville: 3.45
UCONN: 3.94



We ranked 25 overall

I think that's wrong...I'm guessing that's average stars of guys that your schools is recruiting, not actual commits.