Difference between IU and UC

[BoKnows]

From Seth Davis:
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/seth_davis/02/07/hoop.thoughts/1.html

• Speaking of Indiana, I have to say I have never seen a fan base so passionately support a struggling team. The Hoosiers still fill Assembly Hall for every home game, and the place is always rocking. (By contrast, Ohio State couldn't even fill up the Schottenstein Center for its big game at home against Purdue.) The Hoosiers lose a lot of games, but they play their tails off and the fans know it. Their loyalty has been rewarded recently as IU scored home wins over Illinois and Minnesota in the last two weeks. The fans know things will get better in time, but they're not waiting until it happens to show up. Bravo.

Thoughts?


I'm sure a few will question whether or not UC consistently plays hard but we can all agree the fan support during the rebuilding process has not been there.

 

[bearcat jeff]

The way the fans have treated the young men of this program over the last 5 years has really been a sore spot to me.

Mick, Nancy, Thomas, the moon is in Jupiter, any excuse will do. Some say there's big screens at home. I bet they have those in Bloomington to. Hey, I bet the recruits are really impressed by the 4,500 fans that came to watch tonight. Yeah, that's much better than the atmosphere the 10,000 fans created at Xavier when I was there last month. Think I'll go where people support the program.

 

[ralph1950]

Mick had more overall wins and Big East wins then Crean has had overall and in the Big 10 his first three years. UC needs to build a new fan base as half of the old one is gone.

 

[JasonS]

I have always said that the city of Cincinnati has some of the worst fans in all of sports. The Reds win the division last year and can't even fill up half of the ball park until the actual playoffs start. The fans in Cincinnati always need something to bitch about. If it isn't Mick, or Mike Thomas, or Nancy, or the Huggs was fired, it's the Reds don't win enough or they don't have a chance to win the world series so who cares. It drives me absolutely crazy. I would have season tickets to basketball if I lived in Cincinnat or if more home games were on weekends. It kills me that people who actually could go to the games won't. I would give anything to be at all those games.

 

[Bearcat_NTS]

Part of it is the poor Cincinnati fans in general but you also have to consider how the program fell apart with basically a sabatoge from the administration. There were a plethora of fans who didn't return to Assembly Hall after Knight was let go.

 

[JasonS]

Part of it is the poor Cincinnati fans in general but you also have to consider how the program fell apart with basically a sabatoge from the administration. There were a plethora of fans who didn't return to Assembly Hall after Knight was let go.

True but that administration is not here any longer. Nancy is gone. It is time to move forward but unfortunately some people won't let go. It is sad to be honest.

 

[bearcat jeff]

True but that administration is not here any longer. Nancy is gone. It is time to move forward but unfortunately some people won't let go. It is sad to be honest.

Exactly, and you can tell by some of the continual attacks that this is still personal to many. This team is 19-5 and 6-5 in conference. Lots to be happy about.

 

[Bearcat_NTS]

Did you guys see what happened when Bob Knight was terminated at IU...it was much of the same for them. The only difference is they have a larger number of "loyal" and "hardcore" fans. It basically took Mike Davis getting them to the NCAA championship game to get the haters off of his back. Even then he was fired a year or two later. It is going to take a similar type effort (or years of consistency) for Mick to do the same.

 

[TheLongHaul]

I have always said that the city of Cincinnati has some of the worst fans in all of sports. The Reds win the division last year and can't even fill up half of the ball park until the actual playoffs start. The fans in Cincinnati always need something to bitch about. If it isn't Mick, or Mike Thomas, or Nancy, or the Huggs was fired, it's the Reds don't win enough or they don't have a chance to win the world series so who cares. It drives me absolutely crazy. I would have season tickets to basketball if I lived in Cincinnat or if more home games were on weekends. It kills me that people who actually could go to the games won't. I would give anything to be at all those games.

That's funny, it looks like you live in Columbus? I know a lot of people that live in Cincinnati that have IU season tickets. 2 1/2 hour drive to games in Bloomington. They don't use the excuse that they are out of town. I guess we should include you in the worst fan column as well?

Here is a fact that you, along with many other people, don't seem to understand. People, and UC fans in general, have their reasons for not attending UC games. Whether they have family, work, money issues, etc, doesn't really matter. Doesn't make them worse of a fan. If UC does well enough and provides enough entertainment, fans will go to the games.

 

[psax889906]

That's funny, it looks like you live in Columbus? I know a lot of people that live in Cincinnati that have IU season tickets. 2 1/2 hour drive to games in Bloomington. They don't use the excuse that they are out of town. I guess we should include you in the worst fan column as well?

Here is a fact that you, along with many other people, don't seem to understand. People, and UC fans in general, have their reasons for not attending UC games. Whether they have family, work, money issues, etc, doesn't really matter. Doesn't make them worse of a fan. If UC does well enough and provides enough entertainment, fans will go to the games.

Are you seriously calling out a guy that lives in Columbus for not being a season ticket holder?... Come on man.



I think the issue is two pronged (and I'm going to stay away from the Huggins/Nancy reasonings):

1) Cincinnati has professional sports teams. The Reds and Bengals take a lot of money away from UC in ticket sales, merchandise sales, etc. IU is the only show in town. Just like UK, OSU, etc.

2) Even with that said, Cincinnati fans are incredibly apathetic towards sports and need 2X the amount of tangible evidence that the product they see will be good before they attend games. Evidenced by the Division championship run by the Reds this past year. Attendance was pretty poor for a Division Champion- yet, they are seeing a decent boost in season ticket sales for this year.

Why are Cincinnati fans this way? Not really sure. I think the main goal of the athletic department right now should be continually building and establishing a "new" fan base infused with as many 'young professionals' as you can get. The 20's and 30's types out of college that don't necessarily have that apathetic feeling and are able to afford season tickets. That would be my main target demographic.

The football and basketball programs already offer some of the cheapest ticket packages in the Big East- and considering the level of play, the nation. So I don't think there's much more they can do on that end.

Ultimately an NCAA berth this year will help. Sustained success next year would help even more.

 

[TheLongHaul]

Are you seriously calling out a guy that lives in Columbus for not being a season ticket holder?... Come on man.



I think the issue is two pronged (and I'm going to stay away from the Huggins/Nancy reasonings):

1) Cincinnati has professional sports teams. The Reds and Bengals take a lot of money away from UC in ticket sales, merchandise sales, etc. IU is the only show in town. Just like UK, OSU, etc.

2) Even with that said, Cincinnati fans are incredibly apathetic towards sports and need 2X the amount of tangible evidence that the product they see will be good before they attend games. Evidenced by the Division championship run by the Reds this past year. Attendance was pretty poor for a Division Champion- yet, they are seeing a decent boost in season ticket sales for this year.

Why are Cincinnati fans this way? Not really sure. I think the main goal of the athletic department right now should be continually building and establishing a "new" fan base infused with as many 'young professionals' as you can get. The 20's and 30's types out of college that don't necessarily have that apathetic feeling and are able to afford season tickets. That would be my main target demographic.

The football and basketball programs already offer some of the cheapest ticket packages in the Big East- and considering the level of play, the nation. So I don't think there's much more they can do on that end.

Ultimately an NCAA berth this year will help. Sustained success next year would help even more.

No, I'm calling out people for calling out other people that don't go to games even though they don't have a clue as to why they don't go to games. And considering it was an IU vs. UC thread, I think it's a valid reference.

If I had a nickle for every time an out-of-towner said they would be season ticket holders if they lived in town, I'd be a wealthy man.

 

[psax889906]

No, I'm calling out people for calling out other people that don't go to games even though they don't have a clue as to why they don't go to games. And considering it was an IU vs. UC thread, I think it's a valid reference.

If I had a nickle for every time an out-of-towner said they would be season ticket holders if they lived in town, I'd be a wealthy man.

Granted.

I personally just do the best I can to be the best fan possible. I represent the "C". I can't afford decent season tickets and I actually enjoy sitting in different parts of the arena so I don't have a season package but I've been to about half of the games this year at 5th/3rd and my main gripe is I just wish the student body would give this team a chance. I'll be interested to see what the student turnout is on Sunday, given the time of the game.

 

[Who Dey Time]

After (and even during) the Huggins years one of the radio guys had an interesting question that sometimes would come up....

Is UC a coach or is it a program?

Sadly, for some, UC was a coach and the removal of that coach meant removal of their loyalty. They even go so far as wishing failure on the current regime as if that will somehow prove some point even though the current regime was in no way responsible for what happened prior. Those who think like this are, in my opinion, sad and pathetic. Hopefully this year's team can finish strong and make the dance because UC's success will lead these people to cower and hide like they were doing when they were undefeated earlier in the year.

There was backlash after Bobby Knight at IU but the IU fanbase had enough sense about it to understand that the Bobby Knight situation wasn't Mike Davis or Tom Crean's fault and choose to support their program. In that regard, IU has proven that they were/are a basketball program not just a team that is successful because of the coach.

 

[JasonS]

That's funny, it looks like you live in Columbus? I know a lot of people that live in Cincinnati that have IU season tickets. 2 1/2 hour drive to games in Bloomington. They don't use the excuse that they are out of town. I guess we should include you in the worst fan column as well?

Here is a fact that you, along with many other people, don't seem to understand. People, and UC fans in general, have their reasons for not attending UC games. Whether they have family, work, money issues, etc, doesn't really matter. Doesn't make them worse of a fan. If UC does well enough and provides enough entertainment, fans will go to the games.

You want to start throwing stones? Let's go. You don't know anything about me, or my job, or my life, or my family. Good for those IU fans. They obviously have the time and ability to get there. I don't. Wish I did. I have football season tickets because I can make it to most of the games. I am not going to pay for season tickets when I can make it to maybe 4 or 5 games. I go to the ones I can make it to. I just know that if I lived in town, I would be at 90% of the games at least.

I agree with the bolded statement but you are dilusional if you don't think that there are 13,176 fans in the city of Cincinnati that have the means to go to the games. The choice is theirs and a good portion of them are still pissed off about something that happened 5 or 6 years ago. Shoot, some are still pissed at Mick because he went to Louisville to work for Pitino and that's a fact. Cincinnati sports fans, in general, suck. I have lived in several different places around the country and I never realized how shitty Cincinnati fans were until I moved away. So many people in Cincinnati never leave the city so I guess it is pointless to expect them to realize it themselves.

 

[Little Danny]

I agree with Psax's points here, but I will add a third:

3) IU is the flagship university of Indiana. People are going to IU games from Bloomington, Indianapolis, Merrillville, Ft. Wayne, Evansville and all points in between. Not only is Cincinnati not getting people in town going to the games, nobody that lives outside of Greater Cincinnati is going to the game other than some very loyal grads who might catch a handful of b-ball game (I am in this category, although I do have football season tickets). Having a whole state to draw from helps keep the attendance up.

UC needs to figure out how to get some people outside 275 interested in following their sports teams. There are many places that successfully do it. Michigan has two BCS programs, Oklahoma does it, Indiana does, Pennsylvania does it, heck Texas has four.

 

[psax889906]

I agree with Psax's points here, but I will add a third:

3) IU is the flagship university of Indiana. People are going to IU games from Bloomington, Indianapolis, Merrillville, Ft. Wayne, Evansville and all points in between. Not only is Cincinnati not getting people in town going to the games, nobody that lives outside of Greater Cincinnati is going to the game other than some very loyal grads who might catch a handful of b-ball game (I am in this category, although I do have football season tickets). Having a whole state to draw from helps keep the attendance up.

UC needs to figure out how to get some people outside 275 interested in following their sports teams. There are many places that successfully do it. Michigan has two BCS programs, Oklahoma does it, Indiana does, Pennsylvania does it, heck Texas has four.

That's the million dollar question. How do you raise interest overall? Some will say winning. Others will say winning against good teams. Others will say play an exciting brand of basketball/football.

 

[JasonS]

I agree with Psax's points here, but I will add a third:

3) IU is the flagship university of Indiana. People are going to IU games from Bloomington, Indianapolis, Merrillville, Ft. Wayne, Evansville and all points in between. Not only is Cincinnati not getting people in town going to the games, nobody that lives outside of Greater Cincinnati is going to the game other than some very loyal grads who might catch a handful of b-ball game (I am in this category, although I do have football season tickets). Having a whole state to draw from helps keep the attendance up.

UC needs to figure out how to get some people outside 275 interested in following their sports teams. There are many places that successfully do it. Michigan has two BCS programs, Oklahoma does it, Indiana does, Pennsylvania does it, heck Texas has four.

I am in this group too.

In Columbus they can fill a stadium of over 100,000 for football but can't even fill an arena of 18 or 19,000 for the #1 OSU Buckeyes. Why? Apathy. They don't care about basketball here. Only football. They don't care when the Buckeyes suck at basketball and they don't care when they are good. They don't complain either way. It's as if the Buckeyes don't exist. In Cincinnati, all people seem to do is complain. Win or lose, there is always some reason people are unhappy. Neither apathy, or whatever you want to call the Cincinnati "fan base" is good but just an interesting observation.

 

[TheLongHaul]

You want to start throwing stones? Let's go. You don't know anything about me, or my job, or my life, or my family. Good for those IU fans. They obviously have the time and ability to get there. I don't. Wish I did. I have football season tickets because I can make it to most of the games. I am not going to pay for season tickets when I can make it to maybe 4 or 5 games. I go to the ones I can make it to. I just know that if I lived in town, I would be at 90% of the games at least.

I agree with the bolded statement but you are dilusional if you don't think that there are 13,176 fans in the city of Cincinnati that have the means to go to the games. The choice is theirs and a good portion of them are still pissed off about something that happened 5 or 6 years ago. Shoot, some are still pissed at Mick because he went to Louisville to work for Pitino and that's a fact. Cincinnati sports fans, in general, suck. I have lived in several different places around the country and I never realized how shitty Cincinnati fans were until I moved away. So many people in Cincinnati never leave the city so I guess it is pointless to expect them to realize it themselves.

Alright, I apologize. I just get sick and tired of hearing the "Cincinnati fans suck" comment. I heard it one too many times and it got to me. My point is we don't know why people don't go to games. You said yourself that you don't have the time. It is very likely that there are lot of people who live in Cincinnati that don't have the time either. There are a million reasons. Whatever the reason is, the value that they perceive to get out of the game isn't worth the cost. UC needs to increase that value and/or lower the cost to where the public views it to be worth their time.

 

[bearcat jeff]

No offense is intended in this, but Cincinnati has a well known fair weather fan base. It just is what it is. They hold on to the past, are critical above measure even when winning. If they could only realize what their support would do to help the program is so many ways!

 

[Juliepitzer]

I agree with Who dey time on his belief that a very good portion of UC fans are fans of the coach and not the University. But in all honesty, it is that way at a lot of schools. UK under Pitino, IU under Knight, Georgia Tech under Kremins etc. I even saw a huge group at an OSU game holding up placards of Mattas face in front of their own. Those who had to come in and replace those icons had negative bounces in attendance at first.

In all honesty, here I think the fans under Huggins feel unwanted and ridiculed to the point of resentment. In Who dey times description of those fans being "sad and pathetic", it shows what I mean. I think we as fans of the school should accept their bitterness and work towards bringing them back home instead of the "we dont need them" approach most have taken. Get the Huggins fans back and the arena will be full again IMO. A side note. I read attendance this season was down 36% from last season despite our great record. Does anyone know if that is true?