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Fire Mick
- Thread starter TheLivingLegend
- Start date
Help Support BearcatTalk:
There's a very wide gap between "not as excited" and "blaming Mick for all of our problems". There is a middle ground, where fans can be less excited than they were in the 90's and feel that Mick is currently the best choice for the program. Fans can also measure success in different ways. Tournament struggles don't necessarily negate regular season success for everyone.
Well then what are we going to argue about?
cincyguy13
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People are not blaming the conference, the players, assistance coaches, football, and fans? This isn’t happening?Who is doing this?
People are not blaming the conference, the players, assistance coaches, football, and fans? This isn’t happening?
It's interesting though that even those that want Mick out are giving the same excuses.
Huh? Your claim is that people are saying Mick can do no wrong. Spreading blame among many different factors is entirely different.People are not blaming the conference, the players, assistance coaches, football, and fans? This isn’t happening?
So you’re wondering why fans aren’t as excited about today’s team, as opposed to a team that went to 3 straight elite 8s, and 1 final 4, and were top 5 in the country for several years?
So we just making stuff up now
I’ve always said there is a middle ground. I question the people that say he can do no wrong. They blame the fans more than the coach. The fire mick crowd at least admits things he does well.
There shouldn't even be a fire Mick crowd, and I'll say this for the 20th time, I've constantly highlighted things he could do better. But if you want to pretend I'm calling him perfect, so be it. Huggins had way more talent and still neve got anything done in the tourney, besides his early years. And just because I said fan support today is worse than it used to be, does not mean that it's the only thing I believe is wrong. But it certainly doesn't help recruiting. And if you think they have to be at a game to understand how much fan support a team gets, you're wrong. They talk about it on Tv, they see it on ESPN. It's more than just having to be there (although that can be a huge experience). I think Mick needs to realize he needs help offensively, I don't think he has an offensive mind, and I don't expect him to develop one at 45 years old. But he certainly could make the decision to bring in someone who does. I think recently he has shifted his focus onto better offensive players instead of just great athletes who can defend, but he still has a long way to go. Mick is a top 5 defensive coach in the country. Name another coach top 5 in offense or defense you think we are getting today.
It's interesting though that even those that want Mick out are giving the same excuses.
Right lol
jacobkdoyle
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Just thought this was interesting...
Frank Haith left Missouri for dead. Then they hired Kim Anderson, who lasted 3 years. They went 9-23, 10-21, and 8-24 in those 3 years. They had a combined 8-46 SEC record under Anderson. Cuonzo Martin came in and in year 1 got an 8 seed in the NCAA Tournament. And that was without Michael Porter Jr. for 30 games.
If we think it's a miracle that Cronin got us back in the tournament in 5 years, they should put up a Cuonzo Martin statue in Columbia.
Frank Haith left Missouri for dead. Then they hired Kim Anderson, who lasted 3 years. They went 9-23, 10-21, and 8-24 in those 3 years. They had a combined 8-46 SEC record under Anderson. Cuonzo Martin came in and in year 1 got an 8 seed in the NCAA Tournament. And that was without Michael Porter Jr. for 30 games.
If we think it's a miracle that Cronin got us back in the tournament in 5 years, they should put up a Cuonzo Martin statue in Columbia.
jacobkdoyle
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Just thought this was interesting...
Frank Haith left Missouri for dead. Then they hired Kim Anderson, who lasted 3 years. They went 9-23, 10-21, and 8-24 in those 3 years. They had a combined 8-46 SEC record under Anderson. Cuonzo Martin came in and in year 1 got an 8 seed in the NCAA Tournament. And that was without Michael Porter Jr. for 30 games.
If we think it's a miracle that Cronin got us back in the tournament in 5 years, they should put up a Cuonzo Martin statue in Columbia.
Obviously this doesn't mean Mick shouldn't get any credit. He's done the job year in and year out. Missouri could easily miss the tournament in upcoming years. So it's not that I don't appreciate the job he has done. But I just don't think it's good enough to make him untouchable and give him a job for life.
So for every time it gets mentioned that he brought us back from the dead, it's worth remembering that other coaches can do it too...and have. And recently.
This also shows that changes coaches doesn't have to be the end of the world, as long as you end up with a good one. They are now better off than they were under Haith, and probably even Mike Anderson (and obviously Kim Anderson).
People like to bring up the Pitt example for why you don't change coaches. But are we sure? Obviously Stallings flopped. And horribly. But that lasted just 2 years and now they have Capel in there giving it a go. They could very well still end up better off. So far, Dixon has made the tournament as a 6, but they lost right away. So for as bad as Stallings was, the fans (now that he's gone) probably don't feel like they're missing much. Obviously they hit a bump in the road. But as pointed out in this post, the right coach can turn things around very quickly. Even in bad situations.
Which brings me to this now. TCU was 6-48 in the Big 12 in the 3 years before Jamie Dixon got there. And within 2 years they got a 6 seed in the NCAA Tournament. Another coach who took over a terrible situation (with no tradition) and very quickly turned it around.
This stuff happens. All the time.
Defense first
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Obviously this doesn't mean Mick shouldn't get any credit. He's done the job year in and year out. Missouri could easily miss the tournament in upcoming years. So it's not that I don't appreciate the job he has done. But I just don't think it's good enough to make him untouchable and give him a job for life.
So for every time it gets mentioned that he brought us back from the dead, it's worth remembering that other coaches can do it too...and have. And recently.
This also shows that changes coaches doesn't have to be the end of the world, as long as you end up with a good one. They are now better off than they were under Haith, and probably even Mike Anderson (and obviously Kim Anderson).
People like to bring up the Pitt example for why you don't change coaches. But are we sure? Obviously Stallings flopped. And horribly. But that lasted just 2 years and now they have Capel in there giving it a go. They could very well still end up better off. So far, Dixon has made the tournament as a 6, but they lost right away. So for as bad as Stallings was, the fans (now that he's gone) probably don't feel like they're missing much. Obviously they hit a bump in the road. But as pointed out in this post, the right coach can turn things around very quickly. Even in bad situations.
Which brings me to this now. TCU was 6-48 in the Big 12 in the 3 years before Jamie Dixon got there. And within 2 years they got a 6 seed in the NCAA Tournament. Another coach who took over a terrible situation (with no tradition) and very quickly turned it around.
This stuff happens. All the time.
It's a lot easier to recruit to power five conference schools.
jacobkdoyle
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It's a lot easier to recruit to power five conference schools.
We were in the Big East during our 5 year rebuild...?
We were in the Big East during our 5 year rebuild...?
But but but.......
justinhub2003
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Ok. Well let’s see what kind of sustained success Martin has.
I doubt he has 8 straight tourney appearances.
I doubt he has 8 straight tourney appearances.
justinhub2003
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Also , the roster Martin inherited was far better then what Cronin inherited.
Name a player Cronin inherited as good as Jordan Barnett?
Name a player Cronin inherited as good as Jordan Barnett?
jacobkdoyle
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Ok. Well let’s see what kind of sustained success Martin has.
I doubt he has 8 straight tourney appearances.
I would bet against that as well.
jacobkdoyle
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Also , the roster Martin inherited was far better then what Cronin inherited.
Name a player Cronin inherited as good as Jordan Barnett?
Barwin was pretty good...just not at basketball.
Difference of 1 year vs 5 was more the point.
I'm fine with Cronin being the coach for like I have said, the next couple years. But I'm getting less and less worried about what the idea of moving on would mean for us.
And porter brought in buzz and his high recruit cousin. Much better situation than Mick. We are sustaining success but it has become a little stagnant. But at this point it's because we are putting everything on tournament success. We have completely forgotten how good this year really was. How great our team was. We melted down and it hurts, it sucks, it's a whole lot of stuff. But that doesn't take away from the rest of the success of this season.
Defense first
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I would bet against that as well.
Our recruiting ranking wise was slightly better in the big East. However i think Martin did a terrible terrible job at the end of the year with Missouri, he let Porter come back and Jack up every shot he could get. In my opinion because of that they got beat in there conference tournament and in the NCAA tournament. Very poor coaching decision. I think by the first game he was back, the rest of the team was ready to pack it in. Can't have that type of stinginess in a team because one player was more highly regarded. Bad move on Martin's side. As terrible as our year ended, it was better than Missouri's by far. And all that with higher ranked players, taking into consideration Porter sitting all but three games, and then being in the sec.
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jacobkdoyle
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Our recruiting ranking wise was slightly better in the big East. However i think Martin did a terrible terrible job at the end of the year with Missouri, he let Porter come back and Jack up every shot he could get. In my opinion because of that they got beat in there conference tournament and in the NCAA tournament. Very poor coaching decision. I think by the first game he was back, the rest of the team was ready to pack it in. Can't have that type of stinginess in a team because one player was more highly regarded. Bad move on Martin's side. As terrible as our year ended, it was better than Missouri's by far. And all that with higher ranked players, taking into consideration Porter sitting all but three games, and then being in the sec.
I think you are missing the point.