Our average pts scored last year was like 62 pts over all games. I think he is just pointing out that it will be a miracle to average 20 more points per game from one season to the next unless the coach plays a completely new style of offense. I think he is about right with high 60's to low 70's.
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2015-2016 Season
- Thread starter jacobkdoyle
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Our average pts scored last year was like 62 pts over all games. I think he is just pointing out that it will be a miracle to average 20 more points per game from one season to the next unless the coach plays a completely new style of offense. I think he is about right with high 60's to low 70's.
The low minutes for jenifer everyone is saying are for the meat of the schedule against uconn, smu, Tulsa, you know good teams where mick will play his vets most of the game. Now against the cupcakes I wouldn't be suppriesed to see jenifer play more than Caupain once the game is blown open.
This season is our best chance in a long time for something big. You play the best players. Based on my very limited exposure to Jenifer, I'm predicting he'll get plenty of minutes no matter who the competition is. Your guess is as good as mine other than the fact that i have actually seen him live and maybe you haven't. At this point we're all guessing. I definitely predict that one of us will be able to say, "I told you so."
UCBearcats
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The single most impressive thing about KJ in the scrimmage is how he blew around people and took the ball to the basket and finished. So, this whole idea that he can't create shots is inaccurate. He definitely has that ability. When I watch Cobb and compare him to KJ, I just feel Cobb is a more complete player, and is a smarter player. To me, he looks like a high Division 1 starting guard, and he is definitely our best outside shooter, though he was a little inconsistent last year. KJ gets the nod defensively, but I think Cobb is better at generating steals with his quickness.
Most everyone on here is way underestimating Jenifer's minutes this year. All you have to do is listen to Mick's comments on the video that Jacob posted the other day to see that there is no way he's getting single digit minutes. I'd bet my life on that, especially after seeing him in person. Listening to Mick's comments, after what I just saw with my own eyes, makes complete sense. We will see what happens.
KJ didn't create many shots for himself last season in live game action. Doing it in one scrimmage and doing it in a real game against quality competition are two completely different things.
There's no doubt KJ has talent and when he came into games early in his freshman season I actually found him to a very cerebral player. Against quality opponents though he becomes a total liability on offense with his decision making. I'm not sure exactly why but it almost seems like the speed of the game is too much for him and he gets ahead of himself on the floor. That may be a product of playing DIII high school basketball and it could be something he'll grow out of. If it's going to happen this is the season for it to take place.
The single most impressive thing about KJ in the scrimmage is how he blew around people and took the ball to the basket and finished. So, this whole idea that he can't create shots is inaccurate. He definitely has that ability. When I watch Cobb and compare him to KJ, I just feel Cobb is a more complete player, and is a smarter player. To me, he looks like a high Division 1 starting guard, and he is definitely our best outside shooter, though he was a little inconsistent last year. KJ gets the nod defensively, but I think Cobb is better at generating steals with his quickness.
Most everyone on here is way underestimating Jenifer's minutes this year. All you have to do is listen to Mick's comments on the video that Jacob posted the other day to see that there is no way he's getting single digit minutes. I'd bet my life on that, especially after seeing him in person. Listening to Mick's comments, after what I just saw with my own eyes, makes complete sense. We will see what happens.
I think KJ moves well without the ball and FC moves well WITH the ball. I hope KJ has improved his ball skills because last year it was hard for him to create his own shot (off the dribble) and he was clumsy with turnovers when pressured.
I agree with your thoughts on Cronin...there was a lot of high praise there for what Jenifer brings to the table. He did temper that with "you can't have 5 good passes and 6 bad passes". Meaning...he can't be a turnover machine if he wants to play. Apparently he did very well in scrimmage but early reports were that he was initially a little careless with the ball in practice...or at least didn't understand the speed of D1 players. If he can manage turnovers and play serviceable D I expect to see him on the court a lot this year.
UCBearcats
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I think KJ moves well without the ball and FC moves well WITH the ball. .
You just nailed it...........
I think KJ moves well without the ball and FC moves well WITH the ball. I hope KJ has improved his ball skills because last year it was hard for him to create his own shot (off the dribble) and he was clumsy with turnovers when pressured.
I agree with your thoughts on Cronin...there was a lot of high praise there for what Jenifer brings to the table. He did temper that with "you can't have 5 good passes and 6 bad passes". Meaning...he can't be a turnover machine if he wants to play. Apparently he did very well in scrimmage but early reports were that he was initially a little careless with the ball in practice...or at least didn't understand the speed of D1 players. If he can manage turnovers and play serviceable D I expect to see him on the court a lot this year.
Again, I only watched that one scrimmage and he threw 100% good passes during transition and on fast breaks. If he had any turnovers, they were probably in the half court. I was just blown away with his precision during transition.
Again, I only watched that one scrimmage and he threw 100% good passes during transition and on fast breaks. If he had any turnovers, they were probably in the half court. I was just blown away with his precision during transition.
That's awesome...I am excited to see him play!! I think his stat line in the scrimmage was 5 asst 0 TO. I was referring to early reports from practice that he wasn't quite adjusted to the speed of defenders yet (in terms of his passes being intercepted). Maybe he caught on quickly.
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Now against the cupcakes I wouldn't be suppriesed to see jenifer play more than Caupain once the game is blown open.
jenifer go be in game when it's getting blown open
This team might be better defensively than Kenyon last year. We should be without doubt be defense team in country. If you can do it against us in practice it should translate to wonderful things against rest of countryKJ didn't create many shots for himself last season in live game action. Doing it in one scrimmage and doing it in a real game against quality competition are two completely different things.
GuyfromNKY
Well-known member
I think this year all the starters have a good chance of averaging in double figures
Also the total points for each player doesn't mean they're going to score that every game that's just an average throughout the season there might be high games where we score 90 against cupcakes and low games against UConn where we only scored 50
I agree that most starters have a chance to average double figures but Shaq will come up short. I predict:
Caupain - 11
Jenifer - 2
Cobb- 11
Johnson - 6
Shaq - 6
Evans - 4
Clark - 10
Scott - 1
Ellis - 12
Deberry - 5
For a total of about 68 points per game.
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david aka the TYZ
Well-known member
The single most impressive thing about KJ in the scrimmage is how he blew around people and took the ball to the basket and finished. So, this whole idea that he can't create shots is inaccurate. He definitely has that ability. When I watch Cobb and compare him to KJ, I just feel Cobb is a more complete player, and is a smarter player. To me, he looks like a high Division 1 starting guard, and he is definitely our best outside shooter, though he was a little inconsistent last year. KJ gets the nod defensively, but I think Cobb is better at generating steals with his quickness.
Most everyone on here is way underestimating Jenifer's minutes this year. All you have to do is listen to Mick's comments on the video that Jacob posted the other day to see that there is no way he's getting single digit minutes. I'd bet my life on that, especially after seeing him in person. Listening to Mick's comments, after what I just saw with my own eyes, makes complete sense. We will see what happens.
This part I disagree with. I've always thought KJ was the smarter and more complete player. Cobb excels in that he puts points on the board and he can handle the ball. He has that knack to hit any shot when he gets hot and that can't be ignored when you decide games by who scores the most points. KJ's knocks are his shot isn't consistent and he makes lazy passes. Also Cobb is aggressive when it comes to scoring and KJ is fine with deferring, we've had too much of that on this team in the past. I think in a team game though, KJ is more a guy that understands he's one of five and Cobb kind of plays his own game.
I agree that most starters have a chance to average double figures but Shaq will come up short. I predict:
Caupain - 11
Jenifer - 2
Cobb- 11
Johnson - 6
Shaq - 6
Evans - 4
Clark - 10
Scott - 1
Ellis - 12
Deberry - 5
For a total of about 68 points per game.
I am going to make this kind of ridiculous but it may not be too far off and it reflects the general order in which I think they might finish.
Ellis 11.5
Caupain 10.5
Cobb 9.5
Clark 8.5
Thomas 7.5
Johnson 6.5
Deberry 5.5
Evans 4.5
Jenifer 3.5
Scott 2.5
Moore 1.5
71.5 pts/game
This part I disagree with. I've always thought KJ was the smarter and more complete player. Cobb excels in that he puts points on the board and he can handle the ball. He has that knack to hit any shot when he gets hot and that can't be ignored when you decide games by who scores the most points. KJ's knocks are his shot isn't consistent and he makes lazy passes. Also Cobb is aggressive when it comes to scoring and KJ is fine with deferring, we've had too much of that on this team in the past. I think in a team game though, KJ is more a guy that understands he's one of five and Cobb kind of plays his own game.
We perceive things differently (and that's OK!). I feel like Cobb is more of a team player. They were both inconsistent last year. I just feel like when Cobb was inserted into the starting lineup, the team started playing better. Even though both were inconsistent, Cobb was less inconsistent than KJ in my opinion.
I am going to make this kind of ridiculous but it may not be too far off and it reflects the general order in which I think they might finish.
Ellis 11.5
Caupain 10.5
Cobb 9.5
Clark 8.5
Thomas 7.5
Johnson 6.5
Deberry 5.5
Evans 4.5
Jenifer 3.5
Scott 2.5
Moore 1.5
71.5 pts/game
WOW....71.5 for a Cronin team???? That's Loyola Marymount-esque for Mick. I would love to see us break that 70 point barrier!
I think the new shot clock is another factor favoring more minutes for Jenifer. There will be more of a premium placed on the transition game, and getting some easier baskets early in the shot clock. In the past, we tended to pass the ball around the 3 point line and then take a stupid shot late in the shot clock. We'll need to be able to find the open man sooner, and/or create something off the dribble, and that favors Jenifer's game.
Again, all my opinions are based off of seeing him once, so I don't need the scrimmage lecture. I realize I may have witnessed his best performance ever, in a non-stressful situation.
Again, all my opinions are based off of seeing him once, so I don't need the scrimmage lecture. I realize I may have witnessed his best performance ever, in a non-stressful situation.
BearcatSpaniard513
Well-known member
Ellis 15 and 12 (NBA bound baby!)
Caupain 12
Cobb 12
Clark 10
Thomas 7
Johnson 6
Deberry 6
Evans 4
Jenifer 4
Scott 2.5
Moore 1.5
76 ppg! And a Bengals Super Bowl W. Pretty good year for Cincy
Caupain 12
Cobb 12
Clark 10
Thomas 7
Johnson 6
Deberry 6
Evans 4
Jenifer 4
Scott 2.5
Moore 1.5
76 ppg! And a Bengals Super Bowl W. Pretty good year for Cincy
WOW....71.5 for a Cronin team???? That's Loyola Marymount-esque for Mick. I would love to see us break that 70 point barrier!
If it's going to ever happen I think all the pieces are in place. He's preaching scoring and assists. The shot clock should improve the tempo. We have a deeper team. We have several people who can make the "second year jump". We have brought in more offensive talent than has left the team. We worked our butts off in the off season. We are confident and motivated. etc etc
If we only improve a few points per game I would be dissapointed
Bearcatboy
Well-known member
jenifer go be in game when it's getting blown open
Only a couple minutes
david aka the TYZ
Well-known member
We perceive things differently (and that's OK!). I feel like Cobb is more of a team player. They were both inconsistent last year. I just feel like when Cobb was inserted into the starting lineup, the team started playing better. Even though both were inconsistent, Cobb was less inconsistent than KJ in my opinion.
I agree Cobb was less inconsistent. He produced better. I guess I'm speaking more on fundamentally sound and on potential to be a complete player. I just think all aspects of the game KJ has a better all-around game, he just has to start producing. To me Cobb just looks better because he is aggressive on offense and puts the ball in the basket. And that is important because when he is scoring, you can't keep him off the floor. But he was more a one-man show on offense. I saw too many times early on on fast breaks where Cobb pulled up for three rather than try to run numbers and get a shot at the basket. He got shown the bench for it too. People on here before were saying he can create his own shot, that's fine and dandy but we all know we don't run that type of offense and a higher percentage shot and the one Mick strives for is to create easy shots by working the ball inside or to an open shooter. I'm all for giving a guy the green light when he's on fire and Cobb has definitely shown he deserves that. I just think KJ works better in the team game, but at the end of the day Cobb produces points, so... And KJ to me is hands down better in our defensive scheme than Cobb was. Cobb is quick and can defend the ball, but in a half court defense that becomes less important. And we pride ourselves on our halfcourt defense. I think that's why KJ started as long as he did. KJ is a very smart player, he seems to understand the game. He just, like you said, needs to be more consistent and he needs to start producing. I'm tired of four role players on the floor and one guy having to score. I'm actually very interested in seeing how KJ transitions and improves from an underclassman to an upperclassman. Typically that's where good players show themselves. For Cobb, I just hope he hits that shot at a good percentage this year and plays smart. I don't really see anything in his game where he's going to get better at. He's a scoring machine so we need to work that into our gameplan. We really need him off the ball so he can be set up for open shots. I think the first half of the year last year he came in backing up Caupain and he had to handle the ball and thus if he was going to shoot he had to make his own shot. When he's off the ball he can work to get open and our offense (in theory) can just feed him. In the scrimmage (I know, everybody, one scrimmage) we found him for some open looks and he was draining them. I hope we see alot of that this year.
david aka the TYZ
Well-known member
I think the new shot clock is another factor favoring more minutes for Jenifer. There will be more of a premium placed on the transition game, and getting some easier baskets early in the shot clock. In the past, we tended to pass the ball around the 3 point line and then take a stupid shot late in the shot clock. We'll need to be able to find the open man sooner, and/or create something off the dribble, and that favors Jenifer's game.
Again, all my opinions are based off of seeing him once, so I don't need the scrimmage lecture. I realize I may have witnessed his best performance ever, in a non-stressful situation.
I saw the same thing you did in Jenifer. He just had a difference in his passes that you can't teach. I know everybody gives crap over only seeing a guy once, but many coaches and scouts see a guy once and see what they need to see to make an offer and pursue them. I saw something different in him. With that said, I think the only way he sees decent minutes this year is if he can come in and do what he did in the scrimmage in real games and he isn't a complete liability on defense and in the team game. He can't get lost on D and lose his man, he can't forget to box out, etc. and he can't work faster than the rest of the offense. I clearly think he is the type to really make all the players around him better because he has that ability to make that pass for an easy bucket. I hope he's good enough to make Mick give him minutes this year, that will be a great problem for us to have. And if he does that I could see him running point next year with Caupain off the ball. I know we don't need to open that debate up again, but I really do hope he develops quick enough to force Mick's hand in earning minutes. Time will tell obviously.