Fire Mick

[gav]

I remember when I was playing baseball at Cincinnati Aiken High School and went to an awards banquet where Mick was the guest speaker the year he had just came over from Murray state and even back then I wasn't impressed with him.

 

[Gaaangs]

Therein lies the rub...


IF we purely measure each season on NCAA tournament success then sure its not desirable and downright frustrating. Sweet 16? Elite 8? Both of those sound nice, but...in my humblest of opinions...Final Four/National Title is the stick in which to measure March. The Sweet 16's and Elite 8's are nice, but just a label.

Bottom line, and it doesn't matter how you slice it, losing (whether early or late) sucks and its definitive. You can't negate an entire season over it, though.

So I agree with you on NCAA tournament success to a point.

UC has made it past the first weekend of the tournament once since 2001. ONCE. Thats once in 17 years.

To me, that is unacceptable. Im not sure where blame lies or if its even just complete unluck, but thats not good.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

I get this perspective.... Issue is.

Mick promised tempo/offense. He lied.

His style is not conducive to winning big games. He has his team wound so tight that they can't go play basketball. Basketball/offense is a game of flow/rythm. Impossible to establish playing under Mick. One mistake and your out.

At some point you have got to win in post season. This was the year, all the stars aligned and he provided and all time disaster. He failed.

He game plans to a style that matches the talent he is able to recruit. As for not winning games he has done that consistently for years. His teams have performed to winning 30 games two years running. He is the Coach of the year and his players who as you say have trouble playing for him have won many individual honors as well. When I judge Mick I look at the whole package. I want student athletes. I weigh it against how the college system has changed and I base my expectation off of that. Not a one and done tourney. We are lucky to have found a guy who can excel under the system that is not about creating a even playing field. But hey your a paying customer. if you think he should be gone write the board a letter. but as they say, Be careful what you wish for. I have lived through the Yates years.

 

[TheLivingLegend]

He game plans to a style that matches the talent he is able to recruit. As for not winning games he has done that consistently for years. His teams have performed to winning 30 games two years running. He is the Coach of the year and his players who as you say have trouble playing for him have won many individual honors as well. When I judge Mick I look at the whole package. I want student athletes. I weigh it against how the college system has changed and I base my expectation off of that. Not a one and done tourney. We are lucky to have found a guy who can excel under the system that is not about creating a even playing field. But hey your a paying customer. if you think he should be gone write the board a letter. but as they say, Be careful what you wish for. I have lived through the Yates years.

Don't you feel we are approaching marvin territory?

Bottom line. Mick ain't getting fired. But someone (bohn) needs to have a difficult discussion with him about his unwillingness to adapt with the times.

I'd be okay with mick, if his philosophy changed.L I'd be happy if he brought in a new offensive minded assistant coach, and truly adjusted his in game temperament.

The ship is sinking and the captain is in full blown panic mode. That's not ideal.

 

[Gaaangs]

This interview with Cronin is not a good look...

https://twitter.com/FOX19Joe/status/975538049101844480

 

[gav]

Can someone tell me again why people didn't like Huggins. Hes the only coach who has ever got us past the second round more than once and he still does it every year now at West Virginia.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Don't you feel we are approaching marvin territory?

Bottom line. Mick ain't getting fired. But someone (bohn) needs to have a difficult discussion with him about his unwillingness to adapt with the times.

I'd be okay with mick, if his philosophy changed.L I'd be happy if he brought in a new offensive minded assistant coach, and truly adjusted his in game temperament.

The ship is sinking and the captain is in full blown panic mode. That's not ideal.

Marvin lost one playoff game that I really expected him to win. San Diego. He was the betting underdog in every other one. Pittsburgh would have been the exception but AJ Mc. Started that game. Like Mick he inherited a dumpster fire. How would you like to work for Mike Brown?

Mick's style has served him well. My guess is he would be a bit more free with the reigns if he was able to recruit the kind of players that could run a more open system. Being P-6 is a huge obstacle that whoever we bring in will have to navigate around. After two 30 win seasons and a league and conference championship I am not willing to roll the dice on the board finding someone who can do better. Ever heard of Kevin Stallings?

 

[HarryBosch]

not saying I'm not disappointed in how the season ended. I am!! But I'm not willing to fire the coach and roll the dice with someone's hot assistant hoping he does better and then he leaves for a P-5 job if he does.

So we as a fan base are destined to accept under achievement in the NCAA tournament every year? Sooner or later the fan base will start disappearing.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Can someone tell me again why people didn't like Huggins. Hes the only coach who has ever got us past the second round more than once and he still does it every year now at West Virginia.

I don't like Huggins because his stupidity almost killed our program. Fat drunk and stupid is really no way to go through life. Especially if your considered a educator and mentor of young people. His arrogance almost killed our program.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

Don't you feel we are approaching marvin territory?

Bottom line. Mick ain't getting fired. But someone (bohn) needs to have a difficult discussion with him about his unwillingness to adapt with the times.

I'd be okay with mick, if his philosophy changed.L I'd be happy if he brought in a new offensive minded assistant coach, and truly adjusted his in game temperament.

The ship is sinking and the captain is in full blown panic mode. That's not ideal.

It's not the philosophy in general imo. It's the way we close out halves/games. We go into the equivalent of prevent defense. It's the same thing West Va does and it's why they always lose to KU. Playing over 25% of the game in "hang on for dear life" mode is a stupid idea in the tournament, no matter what the score is. If there's anything Cronin needs to learn, it's that. We were up by 3 TDs in the 4th Q and we ran up the middle every time and gave them 15-20 yard passes all the way down the field.

Many fans griped about this a lot this year. And rightfully so.

We did have 65 points with over 10 minutes left. We have guys who can score. That's not the issue. Talent is not the issue. It's taking our foot off the gas and switching to a mode that yields very little PPP. It's a race to run out the clock against a team you've been beating down the whole game. It just changes the mentality. And it's not good for us.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

So we as a fan base are destined to accept under achievement in the NCAA tournament every year? Sooner or later the fan base will start disappearing.

Harry in todays game and how we are positioned in college athletics we are destined to be a also ran. We are at a huge disadvantage and my fear is it will grow wider. Mick is one of the exceptions that still competes. There ain't many of them. I am a lot more unhappy that we were left out of P-5 affiliation then I am about how we lost last nights game.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

Marvin lost one playoff game that I really expected him to win. San Diego. He was the betting underdog in every other one. Pittsburgh would have been the exception but AJ Mc. Started that game. Like Mick he inherited a dumpster fire. How would you like to work for Mike Brown?

Mick's style has served him well. My guess is he would be a bit more free with the reigns if he was able to recruit the kind of players that could run a more open system. Being P-6 is a huge obstacle that whoever we bring in will have to navigate around. After two 30 win seasons and a league and conference championship I am not willing to roll the dice on the board finding someone who can do better. Ever heard of Kevin Stallings?

Oh dear God please not the P6 speech again!

 

[jacobkdoyle]

Harry in todays game and how we are positioned in college athletics we are destined to be a also ran. We are at a huge disadvantage and my fear is it will grow wider. Mick is one of the exceptions that still competes. There ain't many of them. I am a lot more unhappy that we were left out of P-5 affiliation then I am about how we lost last nights game.

Waite, we just lost to Nevada. Tell me what advantages they have over us. Or Harvard, or Creighton, or St Joe's. C'mon. Conference affiliation has nothing to do with why people are upset right now. We aren't losing to those teams in the early rounds. We had a free pass to the elite 8 vs 15 seed SunBelt, 7 seed Mountain West, and 11 seed MVC. The conference excuse does not apply.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Oh dear God please not the P6 speech again!

LOL!!!If you prefer I can have Chad give it to you again. Come on Jake. Your much to smart a kid to not see what is happening in today s college athletics. I hate it every bit as much as you do but it is reality. The NCAA was set up to create a even playing field. You think that is happening? We win at a level that defies logic with Cronin. Even in our own league SMU was caught dirty. Houston has Sampson who was fired at other places for infractions. Memphis and UCONN are not anywhere close to where they were. What is the reasoning. Its conference affiliation. Its not impossible to win but trying to be a school that is a prefered destination has waved bye bye to us. I hate it but when someone like Chad tells us that players who he has contact with do not consider P-6 conferences until after the P-5's have sorted out I can not refuse to believe him.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

LOL!!!If you prefer I can have Chad give it to you again. Come on Jake. Your much to smart a kid to not see what is happening in today s college athletics. I hate it every bit as much as you do but it is reality. The NCAA was set up to create a even playing field. You think that is happening? We win at a level that defies logic with Cronin. Even in our own league SMU was caught dirty. Houston has Sampson who was fired at other places for infractions. Memphis and UCONN are not anywhere close to where they were. What is the reasoning. Its conference affiliation. Its not impossible to win but trying to be a school that is a prefered destination has waved bye bye to us. I hate it but when someone like Chad tells us that players who he has contact with do not consider P-6 conferences until after the P-5's have sorted out I can not refuse to believe him.

Don't need the weekly reminder is all. Good grief man. You're a broken record.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Waite, we just lost to Nevada. Tell me what advantages they have over us. Or Harvard, or Creighton, or St Joe's. C'mon. Conference affiliation has nothing to do with why people are upset right now. We aren't losing to those teams in the early rounds. We had a free pass to the elite 8 vs 15 seed SunBelt, 7 seed Mountain West, and 11 seed MVC. The conference excuse does not apply.

Creighton is in the big east but the others are a fair point. We should have won the game and Nevada operates in the same level that we have. Their is no debate. We should have own the game and didn't. I am responding to the fire Cronin argument.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Don't need the weekly reminder is all. Good grief man. You're a broken record.

Its a broken system. In stead of firing Cronin why not ask the board why we are stuck in a P-6 conference when Pitt, Louisville and others made it out.

 

[waterhead]

you blame the players, but technically couldnt the players be blamed after every loss? Isnt every game a matter of one team of players making more shots than another team of players?

You have to blame the coaching staff at some point.
He kept Jarron in. Big mistake
He played tight-ass iso ball with Evans last 9 minutes. -big mistake
We start off both halves playing loose and balling, then we switch to slow play kill the flow offensive sets. Cronin is calling the plays, not the players

Whether fans want to fire Cronin or not doesn't matter much (at this point) because it ain't happening.

I will place about 25% of the blame for this last game in the following ways. The first two are the least important to me. The refs and the way Nevada played. The 3rd and 4th things are our own players and coaches...and our coach is responsible for both of them. Our players looking like deer in headlights, taking dumb shots, and getting rattled with a 22 point lead is at least 50% on the coach to calm them down or call better plays etc.

The 4th thing is what is bolded above. Especially the Cumerland decision (stupid). There were also at least 2 times when we were just stomping on their throats and we changed something up. We were crushing to start the game and he subbed out leading to us losing momentum. Kyle was killing it. The second was when we started playing stall ball to kill our momentum again.

I am embarrassed we went 10 minutes and coach could not figure out a way to stop the bleeding. It's his job to get the players to snap out of shit like that.

 

[TheRealUC]

It's not the philosophy in general imo. It's the way we close out halves/games. We go into the equivalent of prevent defense. It's the same thing West Va does and it's why they always lose to KU. Playing over 25% of the game in "hang on for dear life" mode is a stupid idea in the tournament, no matter what the score is. If there's anything Cronin needs to learn, it's that. We were up by 3 TDs in the 4th Q and we ran up the middle every time and gave them 15-20 yard passes all the way down the field.

Many fans griped about this a lot this year. And rightfully so.

We did have 65 points with over 10 minutes left. We have guys who can score. That's not the issue. Talent is not the issue. It's taking our foot off the gas and switching to a mode that yields very little PPP. It's a race to run out the clock against a team you've been beating down the whole game. It just changes the mentality. And it's not good for us.

I agree with almost all of this however i don't feel it was the actual slowing down of the game that killed us. I was fine with burning some clock up 22 with 11 minutes left, who wouldn't be? What you can't do is pass around the perimeter for 25 seconds then jack up a jump shot. Like i said before, i don't know what Cronin was telling them in the huddle, but basic basketball IQ should tell you thats a recipe for failure.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

I agree with almost all of this however i don't feel it was the actual slowing down of the game that killed us. I was fine with burning some clock up 22 with 11 minutes left, who wouldn't be? What you can't do is pass around the perimeter for 25 seconds then jack up a jump shot. Like i said before, i don't know what Cronin was telling them in the huddle, but basic basketball IQ should tell you thats a recipe for failure.

Evans was unstoppable going to the hoop in first half. he stopped trying to drive the ball. Can not believe Mick told him to settle for jump shots.