Frustration Thread

[waterhead]

Being at square 1 is a reality every year. You have to make the tourney to do well in the tourney. Define your idea of a successful program.

We have had some success. I am not a Mick basher. My idea of a successful program includes being able to perform in the dance. A great coach should be able to step it up a notch in March...not step it down a notch.

As I said...he needs to make a run and then validate in a reasonable time frame for me to give him the keys to the program for life. He has enough years under his belt (15) that he should be able to learn by now how to get more out of his team on the biggest stage. 8 straight trips with little to show.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

We have had some success. I am not a Mick basher. My idea of a successful program includes being able to perform in the dance. A great coach should be able to step it up a notch in March...not step it down a notch.

As I said...he needs to make a run and then validate in a reasonable time frame for me to give him the keys to the program for life. He has enough years under his belt (15) that he should be able to learn by now how to get more out of his team on the biggest stage. 8 straight trips with little to show.

Fair enough. Let's hope he can deliver because he is very close and I think finding the guy who can do that is not a easy task. The easier path is Mick kicking that door down. The shame is he missed a big opportunity in last years tourney. I think he knows that more then anyone.

 

[waterhead]

Fair enough. Let's hope he can deliver because he is very close and I think finding the guy who can do that is not a easy task. The easier path is Mick kicking that door down. The shame is he missed a big opportunity in last years tourney. I think he knows that more then anyone.

I'm not sure how close he is really. We land about 1 very good impact HS player per year but it's hard to get them all performing well together at that rate. Last year we had Washington and Broome playing as transfers to help. He has to keep using the transfer and juco market if we continue to land talent at the rate we do from HS.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

I think why I struggle with Mick's results so much is because we have been so close. I think that is what frustrates most people.

How about if Gary Clark isn't playing on one leg. Does anyone think we lose a close game to St,Joesph?

How about the game against UCONN. A freaking 3/4 length court shot and they go on to win the NCAA.

We are better then 99% favorable to beat Nevada with a 22 point lead and 11 minutes to go and we blow the game.

If we win those games we are not even having this conversation.

If I had wheels, I'd be a wagon.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

Fair enough. Let's hope he can deliver because he is very close and I think finding the guy who can do that is not a easy task. The easier path is Mick kicking that door down. The shame is he missed a big opportunity in last years tourney. I think he knows that more then anyone.

He can help himself by making adjustments along the way. I get frustrated when we lose and the exact same offseason happens over and over. With no changes to anything. We just run it back. And run it back. And run it back. And run it back. And run it back. You are allowed to do something different.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

He can help himself by making adjustments along the way. I get frustrated when we lose and the exact same offseason happens over and over. With no changes to anything. We just run it back. And run it back. And run it back. And run it back. And run it back. You are allowed to do something different.

Jake he coaches to what he perceives is the strength of his players. Other then the Tourney his results have been good. I guess he could try to attract different players but I do not know enough about that process to offer a opinion. I know he judges talent very well. Why he can't get hem to come to UC has been beat to death. This years squad was put together very well. He won the league and the conference. Was a 2 seed. vA lost and a clear path was there to go to the final 8 or better. We blew a 22 point lead. I really don't have any answers. They are not going to fire him and I really don't know if that is the answer. As Chad mentioned he would get hired in a heartbeat if we let him go. This is a tough job. A program with a rich tradition who' s fan base expects big time results in a system that has less then favorable conditions as we currently stand. If I'm Mick I am telling my agent to float my name. I really think he has only one way to go and that is down. He is probably as hot as he is ever going to be coaching at Cincinnati. For whatever reason he can not attract the kind of recruit that the UC fan base wants and expects which would put him over the top. Might be time for both parties to go their separate ways.

 

[HarryBosch]

I really think Mick recruits kids who fit his style and that he has a legitimate shot at getting. His results other then the NCAA have been quite good.

Other than that Mrs. Lincoln, did you enjoy the play?

 

[cincycpaw]

Come on man. I'm not exonerating Mick. He certainly deserves criticism for the loss but blowing a 22 point lead with 11 minutes to go is a loss that all parties had a hand in.

When a company fails, it’s on the ceo.

That loss is on Mick. He left Cumberland in. He started his awful Jacob Evans dribble for 20 seconds offense early (like he did all freakin year). And most times teams made a comeback. It’s on Mick.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

When a company fails, it’s on the ceo.

That loss is on Mick. He left Cumberland in. He started his awful Jacob Evans dribble for 20 seconds offense early (like he did all freakin year). And most times teams made a comeback. It’s on Mick.

Not trying to exonerate Mick but the players had a hand in that loss as well.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

When a company fails, it’s on the ceo.

That loss is on Mick. He left Cumberland in. He started his awful Jacob Evans dribble for 20 seconds offense early (like he did all freakin year). And most times teams made a comeback. It’s on Mick.

Oh and Cincy when a company fails more times then not the CEO still walks away with his Golden Parachute.

 

[cincycpaw]

Oh and Cincy when a company fails more times then not the CEO still walks away with his Golden Parachute.

Thankfully Mick has a contract.

 

[cincycpaw]

Not trying to exonerate Mick but the players had a hand in that loss as well.

Certainly. But they were also put in certain positions by their coach and he recruited them.

Their is only 1 constant in the last 8 years of tournament with really only very little success - the coaching staff.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Certainly. But they were also put in certain positions by their coach and he recruited them.

Their is only 1 constant in the last 8 years of tournament with really only very little success - the coaching staff.

I understand that but I have watched that replay twice now. 12 of our last 15 shots were jumpers. Evans was killing them going to the basket . We missed wide open shots, Missed lay ups did not drive the ball to the basket. Cumberland's foul was a brain cramp on his part. I know Mick is the head man in charge but there is only so much he can do. Blowing a 22 point lead is not only his screw up its on the players. I believe I could get 5 guys posting on this site and we could close that game out better then they did.

I also agree his record in the Dance is terrible. I think it is a mental obstacle for him now. I have posted this a few times I really think Mick should move on. They won't fire him but if I'm him I am telling my agent that I will listen to other jobs. I don't think he would have a problem finding work. I think he has done a good job here and I respect his efforts but I think him and the University would benefit from him moving on.

 

[cincycpaw]

I understand that but I have watched that replay twice now. 12 of our last 15 shots were jumpers. Evans was killing them going to the basket . We missed wide open shots, Missed lay ups did not drive the ball to the basket. Cumberland's foul was a brain cramp on his part. I know Mick is the head man in charge but there is only so much he can do. Blowing a 22 point lead is not only his screw up its on the players. I believe I could get 5 guys posting on this site and we could close that game out better then they did.

I also agree his record in the Dance is terrible. I think it is a mental obstacle for him now. I have posted this a few times I really think Mick should move on. They won't fire him but if I'm him I am telling my agent that I will listen to other jobs. I don't think he would have a problem finding work. I think he has done a good job here and I respect his efforts but I think him and the University would benefit from him moving on.

Yes, but how does a coach let his players shoot 12 jumpers?

Anyhow, I just want him to grow as a coach and I haven't seen it, so I'm concerned. He is certainly solid...but at a Non-P5 school like we have solid isn't good enough unless you are happy winning 1 conference championship a decade, having a clean program, playing in the NCAA tournament every year but eliminated the 1st weekend. It feels like groundhog day.

Then each off season Mick talks about playing faster, pressing. And the pundits talk about how much we are improved offensively. And then we don't play fast and our offense remains a liability too often. I'm frustrated that it's the same over and over and over. I believe we need a change. That change can be:

1) Magically get into a better conference
2) Mick and coaches grow and change styles a bit
3) Shake up the assistant coaching staff
4) Get rid of Mick

We've already improved the facilities. This offseason if #1 or #2 doesn't happen then #3 or #4 should happen next offseason. Just my opinion, I know there is risk. And to be honest I really just want Mick to tweak his coaching because he has proven to be solid. BUt I really doubt that will happen.

 

[M64W]

Over a period of time, coaches grow into the coach they are. From the time they are a player, son of a coach, assistant coach at different levels, film guy, head coach at different levels, etc, they become who they are in philosophy, offense, defense, recruiting....
Mick is who he is--he is not going to change---you can talk about changing, but real change is not going to happen!

 

[cincyguy13]

Jake he coaches to what he perceives is the strength of his players. Other then the Tourney his results have been good. I guess he could try to attract different players but I do not know enough about that process to offer a opinion. I know he judges talent very well. Why he can't get hem to come to UC has been beat to death. This years squad was put together very well. He won the league and the conference. Was a 2 seed. vA lost and a clear path was there to go to the final 8 or better. We blew a 22 point lead. I really don't have any answers. They are not going to fire him and I really don't know if that is the answer. As Chad mentioned he would get hired in a heartbeat if we let him go. This is a tough job. A program with a rich tradition who' s fan base expects big time results in a system that has less then favorable conditions as we currently stand. If I'm Mick I am telling my agent to float my name. I really think he has only one way to go and that is down. He is probably as hot as he is ever going to be coaching at Cincinnati. For whatever reason he can not attract the kind of recruit that the UC fan base wants and expects which would put him over the top. Might be time for both parties to go their separate ways.

how is this a tough job? because people want to win in the tournament? he never gets ask a tough question. If he does, he acts like it's a crime. He still has great job security after 1 sweet 16 in 12 years. he gets paid well. I think most fans are more than fair with him. not one person expects to be title contenders every year. most said 1 sweet 16 every couple years. Is that a tough job?

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

how is this a tough job? because people want to win in the tournament? he never gets ask a tough question. If he does, he acts like it's a crime. He still has great job security after 1 sweet 16 in 12 years. he gets paid well. I think most fans are more than fair with him. not one person expects to be title contenders every year. most said 1 sweet 16 every couple years. Is that a tough job?

Yes getting to a sweet 16 every couple of years in a non p-5 conference is a tough job.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Yes, but how does a coach let his players shoot 12 jumpers?

Anyhow, I just want him to grow as a coach and I haven't seen it, so I'm concerned. He is certainly solid...but at a Non-P5 school like we have solid isn't good enough unless you are happy winning 1 conference championship a decade, having a clean program, playing in the NCAA tournament every year but eliminated the 1st weekend. It feels like groundhog day.

Then each off season Mick talks about playing faster, pressing. And the pundits talk about how much we are improved offensively. And then we don't play fast and our offense remains a liability too often. I'm frustrated that it's the same over and over and over. I believe we need a change. That change can be:

1) Magically get into a better conference
2) Mick and coaches grow and change styles a bit
3) Shake up the assistant coaching staff
4) Get rid of Mick

We've already improved the facilities. This offseason if #1 or #2 doesn't happen then #3 or #4 should happen next offseason. Just my opinion, I know there is risk. And to be honest I really just want Mick to tweak his coaching because he has proven to be solid. BUt I really doubt that will happen.

What should he have done tackle them. How about the turn overs? The team played terrible as well.

 

[waterhead]

What should he have done tackle them. How about the turn overs? The team played terrible as well.

Someone needed to calm them down. There was nothing calm about Cronin on the sidelines...it screamed panic. His choice to keep Cumberland in tells me just how much panic he was feeling. I can't recall a scenario where he had done that before. It was a panic mistake.

The team was acting like the coach on the sideline. They were taking shots they wouldn't normally take and Cronin was making decisions he wouldn't normally make.

If Cronin learns anything from this game...IMO...it would be to remain calm. He choked and the team choked with him. He needs to handle those situations better if he is going to get past it.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Someone needed to calm them down. There was nothing calm about Cronin on the sidelines...it screamed panic. His choice to keep Cumberland in tells me just how much panic he was feeling. I can't recall a scenario where he had done that before. It was a panic mistake.

The team was acting like the coach on the sideline. They were taking shots they wouldn't normally take and Cronin was making decisions he wouldn't normally make.

If Cronin learns anything from this game...IMO...it would be to remain calm. He choked and the team choked with him. He needs to handle those situations better if he is going to get past it.

A fair assessment. As I said in previous post I will not exonerate Mick. I’m my mind he could have done a better job. That still doesn’t let the team off the hook. You don’t lose a 22 point lead with 11 minutes to go without it being a total breakdown.