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Myself and I believe another poster mentioned in another thread that Cincinnati has never averaged over 70 ppg or ranked in the top 150 in points per game under Mick Cronin. Someone tried to say that was a dumb argument because we play at a very slow pace. I don't remember who it was, but I would like them to explain their position when presented with these facts:

Rank/Field Goal %:

2014-15: 226th, .419
2013-14: 256th, .427
2012-13: 305th, .402
2011-12: 247th, .420
2010-11: 168th, .436
2009-10: 190th, .432
2008-09: 230th, .424
2007-08: 284th, .411
2006-07: 302nd, .405

You can't use the pace argument with field goal percentage. If anything, a team that plays at a slow pace should shoot a higher percentage.
 
bearcat jeff said:
I think this team is made up for playing a match up zone defensively. Just my opinion but Mick Cronin gets above average grades on coaching defense.

Offensively it is the same issues yearly. It seems this staff does not A) recruit well to it B) teach it well C) understand offensive concepts D) all the above. Shooting and agressiveness would cover some of this but UC doesn't recruit shooters and UC doesn't push the ball. You all know I overall like Mick and I like him as our coach because you have to ask "who replaces him?" and Mick wins and runs a clean program. But there at some point has to be someone brought on board who can help in this or a philosophy change has to take place in recruiting and right now Mick Cronin recruits to defense and rebounding.
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Yes! Yes! Yes and Yes! lol Pretty much sums it up. I am really tired of the same offensive woe's year after year. I believe they don't even practice offense. They literally run the exact same offensive play every possession. Motion, which they don't run well. You would think at this point since its all Mick has his players run they would be masters at it. But they aren't. Definition of insanity my friends.
 
UCalum08 said:
Yes! Yes! Yes and Yes! lol Pretty much sums it up. I am really tired of the same offensive woe's year after year. I believe they don't even practice offense. They literally run the exact same offensive play every possession. Motion, which they don't run well. You would think at this point since its all Mick has his players run they would be masters at it. But they aren't. Definition of insanity my friends.
Click to expand...

Motion isn't working with this team because they don't seem to have the basketball IQ to move without the ball. We have two post players who need to touch the ball at least twice as much. Also, outside of Morman and occasionally Caupain, we make no attempt to penetrate.

I almost think we would be better off in an NBA-style isolation offense. Just put Morman or Caupain on the wing and post up Ellis and Clark... either give them the ball and let them work, or penetrate and throw up a shot trying to draw a foul. Ellis and Clark are both excellent offensive rebounders, so if you don't draw the foul, you have a great chance at getting a put-back.
 
Robert said:
Myself and I believe another poster mentioned in another thread that Cincinnati has never averaged over 70 ppg or ranked in the top 150 in points per game under Mick Cronin. Someone tried to say that was a dumb argument because we play at a very slow pace. I don't remember who it was, but I would like them to explain their position when presented with these facts:

Rank/Field Goal %:

2014-15: 226th, .419
2013-14: 256th, .427
2012-13: 305th, .402
2011-12: 247th, .420
2010-11: 168th, .436
2009-10: 190th, .432
2008-09: 230th, .424
2007-08: 284th, .411
2006-07: 302nd, .405

You can't use the pace argument with field goal percentage. If anything, a team that plays at a slow pace should shoot a higher percentage.
Click to expand...


He in no way was saying UC does well on offense. He only said you can't use PPG because all offenses run at a different tempo. His point actually pointed to Florida's offense as to why you shouldn't use PPG, not UC's offense.
 
cincrulz11 said:
He in no way was saying UC does well on offense. He only said you can't use PPG because all offenses run at a different tempo. His point actually pointed to Florida's offense as to why you shouldn't use PPG, not UC's offense.
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Gotcha. And I'm okay with playing at a slow pace as long as we get good looks and move without the ball. Right now, that's just not happening.
 
UCalum08 said:
Yes! Yes! Yes and Yes! lol Pretty much sums it up. I am really tired of the same offensive woe's year after year. I believe they don't even practice offense. They literally run the exact same offensive play every possession. Motion, which they don't run well. You would think at this point since its all Mick has his players run they would be masters at it. But they aren't. Definition of insanity my friends.
Click to expand...

I think you are actually starting to see a recruiting philosophy change with Clark, Moore, Cobb, Jenifer, and Evans.
 
Robert said:
Motion isn't working with this team because they don't seem to have the basketball IQ to move without the ball. We have two post players who need to touch the ball at least twice as much. Also, outside of Morman and occasionally Caupain, we make no attempt to penetrate.

I almost think we would be better off in an NBA-style isolation offense. Just put Morman or Caupain on the wing and post up Ellis and Clark... either give them the ball and let them work, or penetrate and throw up a shot trying to draw a foul. Ellis and Clark are both excellent offensive rebounders, so if you don't draw the foul, you have a great chance at getting a put-back.
Click to expand...

Bingo. This falls on the coaching. The coaches are clearly not teaching their players anything on the offensive side of the floor. Year after year our players can't run an effective offense. 8 years into the program and we have seen little to none improvement. Its starting to become a legitimate concern.
 
The offense had actually been very efficient the previous two games. Last night was a complete disaster. The guards were nonexistent and this isn't a group of guards that were recruited for their defense. Outside of one game Cobb looking a lot more like a guy whose only other offer was from San Francisco.
 
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UCalum08 said:
Bingo. This falls on the coaching. The coaches are clearly not teaching their players anything on the offensive side of the floor. Year after year our players can't run an effective offense. 8 years into the program and we have seen little to none improvement. Its starting to become a legitimate concern.
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It's always a concern for me but I don't say much when we win because I like to focus on positives. But times like last night and the Harvard game to end last season remind me how much it bothers me. I hate missed lay ups and lack of agressiveness to the basket. Pass and cut to the basket, get in the creases and draw guys to you. I get so mad when I see guys pass it around the three point line and nobody move.
 
Bearcat04 said:
The offense had actually been very efficient the previous two games. Last night was a complete disaster. The guards were nonexistent and this isn't a group of guards that were recruited for their defense. Outside of one game Cobb looking a lot more like a guy that whose only other offer was from San Francisco.
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Not sure how you can justify that. The more we start playing quality Div. I schools the more we will be exposed. Before Ole' Miss we won games on having better overall talent.
 
bearcat jeff said:
It's always a concern for me but I don't say much when we win because I like to focus on positives. But times like last night and the Harvard game to end last season remind me how much it bothers me. I hate missed lay ups and lack of agressiveness to the basket. Pass and cut to the basket, get in the creases and draw guys to you. I get so mad when I see guys pass it around the three point line and nobody move.
Click to expand...

I couldn't agree more with you. Exactly how I feel.
 
Bearcat04 said:
1.35 and 1.24 PPP is efficient offense.
Click to expand...

Where was that "efficient" offense last night? We won all our games off better talent. Just wait til after the Stony game. We will continue to struggle to score once we go against quality teams.

You can throw all the numbers in world at me, you won't convince me our offense is okay. There is a difference between efficient and effective.
 
UCalum08 said:
Where was that "efficient" offense last night? We won all our games off better talent. Just wait til after the Stony game. We will continue to struggle to score once we go against quality teams.

You can throw all the numbers in world at me, you won't convince me our offense is okay. There is a difference between efficient and effective.
Click to expand...

Who said the offense is okay? Simply pointing out that contrary to popular belief this team is capable of playing efficient offense. Playing that poor against an average Ole Miss team was disappointing.
 
If they are playing this poorly in February, I'll be concerned. For now, I just hope they get a quality win or two in the OOC schedule. I would be thrilled with 2 wins out of the NC State, Nebraska, Xavier, VCU and SDSU group.
 
I've always been apathetic towards our offensive sets. If guys have a hard time running a motion offense, you need a more structured approach to get open shots.

Against a zone, you fill the gaps and overload a side with shooters. You throw in a few picks to clear out a side for a post player. You must drive to the hoop, which UC did effectively but far too late into the second half to matter. I like Mick. I'll sing his praises all day long because he took a program from a death sentence and made us relevant again. But I've always questioned his offensive philosophy. Defense doesn't win championships - you need to score. We lost to a good Harvard team last year because they could score and we couldn't. We lost to Creighton the year before because of the same reason. UC is not typically blown out - our defense keeps us in the game but our offense doesn't do enough to win the game.
 
Mcginnjw said:
I think you are actually starting to see a recruiting philosophy change with Clark, Moore, Cobb, Jenifer, and Evans.
Click to expand...

I think we've been getting legit scorers already, its just once they get to U.C. the system is so bad they don't score. I know it's vs various high school comp but the kids we have been bringing in were THE scorers on their respective teams. They get to U.C. and forget how to score? Something else is wrong...
 
Bcatfollower said:
I think we've been getting legit scorers already, its just once they get to U.C. the system is so bad they don't score. I know it's vs various high school comp but the kids we have been bringing in were THE scorers on their respective teams. They get to U.C. and forget how to score? Something else is wrong...[/QUOTE
I think its the coaching. I truly believe they don't spend anytime working on offense.
Click to expand...
 

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