State of the team

[#BearcatNation]

Tradition is definitely important regardless of how long ago it was. It's much better to talk about having national championships and final 4's than to not be able to talk about that. However your point is still valid on some levels. First off if we are going to land high major kids the schools we are recruiting against will have similar traditions to point to as well. Kids today care about being on TV, going to the tournament, playing time, how many kids the program has sent to the NBA, style of play, facilities, geography, and many other specialized areas. If you dont have those things your tradition wont mean much especially if its over 50 years ago. Tradition we have. It's the other things that concern me going forward. We have sent one player to the NBA in Mick's tenure. Our arena and locker rooms are crap. We are not in a P5 conference. Just fixing those three things right there would have a much higher impact on recruiting than program tradition in my opinion.

Thank you. Exactly what I was trying to say. I'm not trying to diss our history/tradition. I'm aware it's a big deal. My point is it's simply not as important as current things going on, such as what you've mentioned.

 

[IDC]

I know a popular topic here is Micks ability, or lack thereof, to find shooters. I think its going to be even more important the next 3 years for Mick to find these guys. The offense will revolve around Gary for 3 more years, and Mick is going to have to make teams pay for doubling. Having guys that can knock down the 3 off the dbl team is going to be critical for this team going forward. Hopefully Troy Kevin Cobb and Evans can be these guys

 

[jacobkdoyle]

This is a great thread.

 

[cincrulz11]

Hopefully Troy Kevin Cobb and Evans can be these guys

And the 3 that are currently here are 76-190 from 3 in conference play. Exactly 40%.

 

[#BearcatNation]

This is a great thread.

Agreed. Nice discussion with valid points all across the board. Nobody being too harsh and no overreacting/taking things personally. More like these please!

 

[Bulldog01]

Cronin is not present at games or practices (drills), not even close to 24/7.

Clark is not 6'10". If JL embraced role, no telling how good he could have been. KJ was mini cobb in some big wins last year. Bishop also much more consistent and apparently healthier last year.

Bottom line, we lost a lot more than just SK. We lost two 4 year seniors who had leadership and played majority of career in BEast and coach of year for majority of season.

Who the hell is bishop?

 

[Bulldog01]

I agree with most of what's being said. In summary, we're currently a "good" program, but we all want to get back to being "great." We can agree on that.

One thing I'd like to say though: Can we cut the crap about how amazing we were in the '50s and '60s? That literally has nothing to do with today. Nothing. I'll give you the Huggins years as recent success that we're striving to get back towards, because that's still relatively fresh, but no programs tout success from 50+ years ago. Yes, that era is what built the program, but a heck of a lot of programs used to be stellar and are now literally nothing. We still compete year in, year out. You know who else won titles in the '50s and '60s? CCNY, La Salle, San Francisco, Loyola Chicago, and Texas Western. Where are they now? After how abysmal we were in the '80s, it's a miracle that we've made 18 of the last 23 NCAA tourneys.

I guess it depends on how you look at it. We could certainly be a better program right now, but we also could be a lot worse. We've had a lot of ups and downs, as every program has, other than say UK, Duke, Kansas, and UNC. Just because we were dominant in the '50s-'60s never meant we were going to be stellar forever.

come on man. Oscar has statue outside gym and is at games courtside. NO player under Huggins could sit next to big o and look good.

 

[Bulldog01]

I personally think our recruiting has been alright. We have good players. And next year when we know for sure how to use them all, I'm expecting a 27-4 type regular season with a top 3 NCAA seed. We CANNOT whiff on the 2016 class though like we did in 2011. That would be unacceptable to me.

Recruiting has been cool. Development of the players has been horrible. Not to mention it seems every year couple players were ineligible or transfer

 

[bearcat jeff]

Cincinnati is second in the league in shooting percentage. Yeah look it up. The last 4 games they have 4 players averaging double digits so things are taking a positive turn offensively and next season the team returns every major contributor.

This season likely will make five in a row the program makes the NCAA. It's time the school invests in the program and markets it. The head coach has done his job with a very poor budget, below average facilities and minimal marketing and selling of the program.

The future is bright and now it's time for the boosters and admin to go all in. I completely agree about recruiting but the school needs to do its part to give the staff the competitive edge it needs as well.

 

[handwaver]

The Big O is a living legend. His name still comes up all the time in the basketball world. I know all the recruits watch NBA and see what Westbrook is doing. When you watch OKC the announcers bring up every game that in February, Russell had 30 PPG 10 APG 9 RPG. He is the 2nd person ever to do that in a month. The other is Oscar, and he did it 12 times. His name still carries a TON of weight and his accomplishments are brought up regularly. They showed him with Bill Russell at the All-Star festivities just this year too.

C'mon! Oscar averaged (averaged!) a triple double for an entire freaking NBA year! And really, he more or less (don't quibble about a tenth of a rebound here or half an assist there) did it for five freaking years!!!

That said, prospective recruits don't give a rat's ass about that ancient history...hell, to today's high school kids, the Korean War is on a par with Julius Caesar...Vietnam Nam might as well have been just after Lincoln...they never experienced a world without iPhones for God's sake. Make some noise in the tourney today, not back when their grandpas were listening to Elvis, & they will come.

 

[UCalum08]

Cincinnati is second in the league in shooting percentage. Yeah look it up. The last 4 games they have 4 players averaging double digits so things are taking a positive turn offensively and next season the team returns every major contributor.

This season likely will make five in a row the program makes the NCAA. It's time the school invests in the program and markets it. The head coach has done his job with a very poor budget, below average facilities and minimal marketing and selling of the program.

The future is bright and now it's time for the boosters and admin to go all in. I completely agree about recruiting but the school needs to do its part to give the staff the competitive edge it needs as well.

Couldn't agree more Jeff! Its amazing what Cronin has done with our program. The fact we have a solid chance of going to the tourney is all because of Cronin and his coaches establishing his philosophies. It makes me one proud alum to see the program ran the right way. Its time the university, boosters etc get behind it as well. I think majority of the support takes what we have for granted.

 

[L-T]

Couldn't agree more Jeff! Its amazing what Cronin has done with our program. The fact we have a solid chance of going to the tourney is all because of Cronin and his coaches establishing his philosophies. It makes me one proud alum to see the program ran the right way. Its time the university, boosters etc get behind it as well. I think majority of the support takes what we have for granted.

"Amazing what Cronin has done"...is where there is a huge amount of disagreement amongst UC Boosters. For me, and I've supported the program for a very long time, I would get nowhere near the word "amazing" in describing his years as coach. There are many many boosters right with me on that, and I don't think this season has changed any opinions.

The good news is that we potentially look poised to take the next step up, and if we do, that could be what the program needs to bring the lost fans back. We're at a crossroads right now. Mick must seize this moment and get the program back amongst the elite and keep us there. I have to admit, I'm pretty excited about next year and even believe there's some excitement still to come in this season.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

"Amazing what Cronin has done"...is where there is a huge amount of disagreement amongst UC Boosters. For me, and I've supported the program for a very long time, I would get nowhere near the word "amazing" in describing his years as coach. There are many many boosters right with me on that, and I don't think this season has changed any opinions.

The good news is that we potentially look poised to take the next step up, and if we do, that could be what the program needs to bring the lost fans back. We're at a crossroads right now. Mick must seize this moment and get the program back amongst the elite and keep us there. I have to admit, I'm pretty excited about next year and even believe there's some excitement still to come in this season.

Next year is huge for us on the court and in recruiting. We will know for sure if we have a shot to be a Top 3 seed at Mick's best. And the 2016 class will let us know if we have to expect another "down year" after a peak, or if we can reload and stay towards the top.

 

[UCalum08]

"Amazing what Cronin has done"...is where there is a huge amount of disagreement amongst UC Boosters. For me, and I've supported the program for a very long time, I would get nowhere near the word "amazing" in describing his years as coach. There are many many boosters right with me on that, and I don't think this season has changed any opinions.

The good news is that we potentially look poised to take the next step up, and if we do, that could be what the program needs to bring the lost fans back. We're at a crossroads right now. Mick must seize this moment and get the program back amongst the elite and keep us there. I have to admit, I'm pretty excited about next year and even believe there's some excitement still to come in this season.

I could be wrong bc I'm not around the boosters but I would assume that a lot of the boosters who don't acknowledge Cronin's success are stuck in the past. College basketball is different than it was 15 years ago. Mick just like our football program gets the most out of the resources better than any other coach. Terrible city support, terrible marketing, outdated facilities, not enough money to travel for recruiting but yet we still have success. I don't see the financial investment from the big boosters but yet they want to complain about what Mick has accomplished. Pretty hypocritical if you ask me.

 

[L-T]

I could be wrong bc I'm not around the boosters but I would assume that a lot of the boosters who don't acknowledge Cronin's success are stuck in the past. College basketball is different than it was 15 years ago. Mick just like our football program gets the most out of the resources better than any other coach. Terrible city support, terrible marketing, outdated facilities, not enough money to travel for recruiting but yet we still have success. I don't see the financial investment from the big boosters but yet they want to complain about what Mick has accomplished. Pretty hypocritical if you ask me.

You don't see the financial investment from the big boosters? Really? Varsity Village? The bubble? Nippert Stadium? New basketball locker rooms? We're about to spend a hundred million renovating the basketball arena. How in the world is college basketball different than it was 15 years ago. The same exact teams are at the top of the basketball universe, generally speaking, that were there 15 years ago, except that the Cincinnati name has disappeared from the mix. 15 years ago, we were in a mid-major conference and ranked #1, and today we're back in a mid-major conference, but nowhere near #1. The only thing different here is that we suddenly decided we can walk among the big boys in football and we decided to funnel a lot of our money there. Since I'm a basketball fan 1st, chasing the football dream is something I'm not happy about, and feel there is very little chance we'll ever see that dream come true.

As I've said, we're at a very critical time right now. We finally have what looks like a real solid foundation of players that will be back next year and hopefully elevate the program to a spot that will excite the fanbase. As Jacob so correctly pointed out, will Mick reload in 2016 and keep us among the big boys? It's all about recruiting, and his recruiting hasn't been all that great. The momentum is building and this is his chance to step up to the plate and do something big. The next two years will be very interesting.

 

[UCalum08]

You don't see the financial investment from the big boosters? Really? Varsity Village? The bubble? Nippert Stadium? New basketball locker rooms? We're about to spend a hundred million renovating the basketball arena. How in the world is college basketball different than it was 15 years ago. The same exact teams are at the top of the basketball universe, generally speaking, that were there 15 years ago, except that the Cincinnati name has disappeared from the mix. 15 years ago, we were in a mid-major conference and ranked #1, and today we're back in a mid-major conference, but nowhere near #1. The only thing different here is that we suddenly decided we can walk among the big boys in football and we decided to funnel a lot of our money there. Since I'm a basketball fan 1st, chasing the football dream is something I'm not happy about, and feel there is very little chance we'll ever see that dream come true.

As I've said, we're at a very critical time right now. We finally have what looks like a real solid foundation of players that will be back next year and hopefully elevate the program to a spot that will excite the fanbase. As Jacob so correctly pointed out, will Mick reload in 2016 and keep us among the big boys? It's all about recruiting, and his recruiting hasn't been all that great. The momentum is building and this is his chance to step up to the plate and do something big. The next two years will be very interesting.

Just like you said, money went to varsity village, nippert, the bubble...where is the money for basketball? After 8 years of blood sweat and tears Mick has brought the program back from hell...all with minimal support, especially financially. Just now the university is looking to the basketball program.
Also you pointing out 15 years ago we were in a mid level conference but ranked #1 but now we are in a mid level conference but not anywhere near that. Well that's because A) college basketball has changed from 15 years ago in every faucet B) Cronin and the program are limited to what they can do in terms of recruiting and selling. Point of the statement is I feel there is a large group of deep financial pockets that expect UC glory days to be relived but don't want to put up the money. We are lucky Cronin has personal feelings about UC and wants to be here, because 9 out of 10 coaches would have jumped ship or been fired for not having success like Cronin has.

 

[Nayers]

Just like you said, money went to varsity village, nippert, the bubble...where is the money for basketball? After 8 years of blood sweat and tears Mick has brought the program back from hell...all with minimal support, especially financially. Just now the university is looking to the basketball program.
Also you pointing out 15 years ago we were in a mid level conference but ranked #1 but now we are in a mid level conference but not anywhere near that. Well that's because A) college basketball has changed from 15 years ago in every faucet B) Cronin and the program are limited to what they can do in terms of recruiting and selling. Point of the statement is I feel there is a large group of deep financial pockets that expect UC glory days to be relived but don't want to put up the money. We are lucky Cronin has personal feelings about UC and wants to be here, because 9 out of 10 coaches would have jumped ship or been fired for not having success like Cronin has.

^^^This!

 

[jacobkdoyle]

Also you pointing out 15 years ago we were in a mid level conference but ranked #1 but now we are in a mid level conference but not anywhere near that. Well that's because A) college basketball has changed from 15 years ago in every faucet

I'm not sure I follow this part.

 

[L-T]

Just like you said, money went to varsity village, nippert, the bubble...where is the money for basketball? After 8 years of blood sweat and tears Mick has brought the program back from hell...all with minimal support, especially financially. Just now the university is looking to the basketball program.
Also you pointing out 15 years ago we were in a mid level conference but ranked #1 but now we are in a mid level conference but not anywhere near that. Well that's because A) college basketball has changed from 15 years ago in every faucet B) Cronin and the program are limited to what they can do in terms of recruiting and selling. Point of the statement is I feel there is a large group of deep financial pockets that expect UC glory days to be relived but don't want to put up the money. We are lucky Cronin has personal feelings about UC and wants to be here, because 9 out of 10 coaches would have jumped ship or been fired for not having success like Cronin has.

In case you don't know, basketball has been a huge benefactor from the creation of varsity village. The weight room, medical training/ rehab facilities, practice gym, coaches offices, meeting/video classrooms, Lindner Center as a whole, etc. are state of the art. Thats why I laugh when people say that our facilities are holding Mick back. There is one facility that might be impacting Mick and that is the Shoe, and that is only because the fans haven't seen enough success to motivate them to endure that horrible upper deck experience. As you might see the next couple years, if we become a highly ranked team, and make some noise in the dance, and start to sustain it, those horrible seats will start having butts in them again....and that one facility won't look so bad anymore. I'll agree with you on one point though....Mick has gotten the raw end of the chase of the football dream.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

"Amazing what Cronin has done"...is where there is a huge amount of disagreement amongst UC Boosters. For me, and I've supported the program for a very long time, I would get nowhere near the word "amazing" in describing his years as coach. There are many many boosters right with me on that, and I don't think this season has changed any opinions.

The good news is that we potentially look poised to take the next step up, and if we do, that could be what the program needs to bring the lost fans back. We're at a crossroads right now. Mick must seize this moment and get the program back amongst the elite and keep us there. I have to admit, I'm pretty excited about next year and even believe there's some excitement still to come in this season.

Mick would be scooped up so fast if he was let go or decided to leave it would be comical. I'm sure the donors are a well meaning group and they are essential to the program but donating money does not make them experts on running a team or a athletic department. I'm not going to start a debate about the job,circumstances or other issues dealing with the team it has been done to death. Enjoy the games.