Tulane Game Thread

[Goldpanner]

Not blaming him for all 5 (I believe he was 3-3 over Vogt, 1-1 over Sorolla and 1-1 over Keith). But him pulling Vogt to the perimeter hurt us way more than just him hitting threes.

Vogt on the perimeter takes away our interior defender and makes Vogt useless for defensive rebounding. Besides that, Tulane also put Vogt in a lot of pick-and-rolls and had a fair amount of success with it. There's a reason Brannen went to Diarra at center for a while this game.

Hence Brannen changing and adapting. May not have been correct, but he did adapt as some say he doesn’t.

 

[skyblade]

You haven't given me a solution. Maybe you have, I don't know. But you either want him guarding his man or protecting the rim? He can't do both, and you need he's offense. So what's the solution?

A zone seems like the obvious solution.

 

[cincyguy13]

Lol I mean we’re cincinnati and we just allowed 76 points from Tulane and people are defending the current strategy.

I’ve dropped my bias. Every one drop theirs too,

We suck at defense.

And it seems Brannen has very little respect for other coaches considering he makes no adjustments at half when seemingly the other team is.

Perfect example: Chris Mack can’t coach defense and is a packline defense guy. But when Xavier was at its best a few years ago, it was because he was willing to mix up a 1-3-1 that confused so many teams.

Mack was also in his 5 year and had his guys. I think that helps more than people want to except.

 

[cincyguy13]

A zone seems like the obvious solution.

So a zone will fix all the problems defensively? And if teams can shoot? Then what? Keep playing it? Can you imagine playing a zone against Iowa.

 

[TheLivingLegend]

Mack was also in his 5 year and had his guys. I think that helps more than people want to except.

I thibk Brannen with his guys may turn out good. Hes got a history of starting poor.


But his inability to adapt to current roster is concerning

 

[skyblade]

So a zone will fix all the problems defensively? And if teams can shoot? Then what? Keep playing it? Can you imagine playing a zone against Iowa.

You don't have to play a zone all the time. But it should be used on a situational basis. If the opposing teams 5 isn't a shooter (UConn), then play man-to-man. But if they are, then use a zone at least part of the time to try to confuse the other team.

Against a team where everyone can shoot, we are in trouble regardless. You either live with it, go small with Scott at the 5 or play Diarra at the 5.

 

[cincyalum2014]

UC basketball is a shell of what it was... I don’t care how many 4 stars are coming in or how fast you want to play, you turn the ball over this much in EVERY game you will lose to teams such as yes........ Tulane


Bowling Green, Colgate, Tulane..... let that sink in

 

[cincyguy13]

I thibk Brannen with his guys may turn out good. Hes got a history of starting poor.


But his inability to adapt to current roster is concerning

I get it, losing these games sucks, and is concerning but I don't think the adjustments are as easy as some are claiming. But we are all just venting and looking for answers.

 

[cincyguy13]

You don't have to play a zone all the time. But it should be used on a situational basis. If the opposing teams 5 isn't a shooter (UConn), then play man-to-man. But if they are, then use a zone at least part of the time to try to confuse the other team.

Against a team where everyone can shoot, we are in trouble regardless. You either live with it, go small with Scott at the 5 or play Diarra at the 5.

That's my overall point. We are in trouble regardless. If we put our best defense on the floor, we can't score or create a shot. Vogt is an automatic bucket. I don't think taking him out is going to make this team better overall.

 

[TheLivingLegend]

I get it, losing these games sucks, and is concerning but I don't think the adjustments are as easy as some are claiming. But we are all just venting and looking for answers.

Id agree... One thing is certain. Of you turn the ball over you should lose minutes. The turnovers have to stop

 

[justinhub2003]

I normally take Rick Broerings takes on UC with a grain of salt, but on the skinny podcast basketball edition. Something stuck out.

On UC’s defense under CJB:
“Nku had issues with John style, but they were good enough offensively to Overcome it”
Basically insinuating that defensive breakdowns are not going away. Brannen just try to out score teams not defend.

 

[justinhub2003]

So a zone will fix all the problems defensively? And if teams can shoot? Then what? Keep playing it? Can you imagine playing a zone against Iowa.

I don’t think anyone is asking UC to become Syracuse.


I think we’re asking for adjustments and changing defenses every few possessions.

As the games progress teams get more and more comfortable scoring against us.

We aren’t used to that. We are used to see UC locking down teams from scoring in the last 4 minutes

 

[cincyguy13]

Id agree... One thing is certain. Of you turn the ball over you should lose minutes. The turnovers have to stop

Yep, and most of those are from our older guys. Maybe it's time to start giving other guys minutes. Harvey, Diarra, Davenport. The only way we are making the tourney is by winning the conference tourney anyway. Might as well get everyone ready for it.

 

[skyblade]

That's my overall point. We are in trouble regardless. If we put our best defense on the floor, we can't score or create a shot. Vogt is an automatic bucket. I don't think taking him out is going to make this team better overall.

We haven't played many teams where everyone can shoot. But in those few games Vogt has been more harm than good.

In those games, we are probably better off giving Diarra a lot of minutes. Diarra is superior to Vogt at defense and rebounding (especially offensive rebounding).

There will be plenty of games where Vogt gives us more on offense then he gives up on defense. But there will be some where he is more harm than good despite his offense. Having a zone as an option would minimize the number of games where Vogt is more harm than good.

 

[cincyguy13]

I don’t think anyone is asking UC to become Syracuse.


I think we’re asking for adjustments and changing defenses every few possessions.

As the games progress teams get more and more comfortable scoring against us.

We aren’t used to that. We are used to see UC locking down teams from scoring in the last 4 minutes

We are also use to having teams with players that can only play defense. That is what they are recruited for. Brooks, Ellie, Shaq thomas, Logan Johnson, etc.. I would hope we would be good at defense is our whole team consist of players who are long and recruited to play defense. His style is different, It's not going to look the same. Especially this year, when we got half our team in June. Will it work, I have no idea but I do know he won a lot of games at a school that was new to Division 1 basketball. That seems like it's hard to do.

 

[cincyguy13]

We haven't played many teams where everyone can shoot. But in those few games Vogt has been more harm than good.

In those games, we are probably better off giving Diarra a lot of minutes. Diarra is superior to Vogt at defense and rebounding (especially offensive rebounding).

There will be plenty of games where Vogt gives us more on offense then he gives up on defense. But there will be some where he is more harm than good despite his offense. Having a zone as an option would minimize the number of games where Vogt is more harm than good.

Do you think Vogt was more harm or good today? Seems like we did not do well with him off the court but I'm sure you may have a different opinion.

 

[cincyguy13]

When Vogt was off out, they were also scoring at will. It's almost like there are other issues.

 

[skyblade]

We are also use to having teams with players that can only play defense. That is what they are recruited for. Brooks, Ellie, Shaq thomas, Logan Johnson, etc.. I would hope we would be good at defense is our whole team consist of players who are long and recruited to play defense. His style is different, It's not going to look the same. Especially this year, when we got half our team in June. Will it work, I have no idea but I do know he won a lot of games at a school that was new to Division 1 basketball. That seems like it's hard to do.

Brannen is a lot more willing to play guys who only play offense then we've seen in the past. We have 3 primary offense guys this year (Vogt, Sorolla, Jaevin), I have trouble even thinking of our last 3 primary offense guys (Broome, Washington and ??).

He also seems less willing to play those who only play defense (though McNeal still gets a fair number of minutes and Diarra has started getting more).

My biggest concern remains that it is harder to teach primary offense guys defense. Guys like Vogt, Sorolla and Jaevin lack the athleticism to ever be good defenders. Athletic defenders can become great on offense (though they don't always achieve the potential).

If Brannen is as good at teaching offense as he supposedly is, I'd rather see him get the athletic defenders and develop their offense.

 

[skyblade]

Do you think Vogt was more harm or good today? Seems like we did not do well with him off the court but I'm sure you may have a different opinion.

Well Brannen saw something as well, there's a reason Vogt sat for a fairly long period of the second half (and Diarra played over Sorolla). I'd say Vogt came out relatively even. His defense/rebounding was bad, but 21 points makes up for it.

 

[cincyguy13]

Brannen is a lot more willing to play guys who only play offense then we've seen in the past. We have 3 primary offense guys this year (Vogt, Sorolla, Jaevin), I have trouble even thinking of our last 3 primary offense guys (Broome, Washington and ??).

He also seems less willing to play those who only play defense (though McNeal still gets a fair number of minutes and Diarra has started getting more).

My biggest concern remains that it is harder to teach primary offense guys defense. Guys like Vogt, Sorolla and Jaevin lack the athleticism to ever be good defenders. Athletic defenders can become great on offense (though they don't always achieve the potential).

If Brannen is as good at teaching offense as he supposedly is, I'd rather see him get the athletic defenders and develop their offense.

I disagree with it is easier to teach defensive guys offense. We have 15 years of that says other wise. Name 2 defensive guys that have become good offensively in the last 15 years. Maybe Brooks? but even he would miss 2 layups/dunks a game. I think it hard to do either but it is almost impossible to teach justin jackson how to dribble or shot.