2017-2018 Season

[GarradJ21]

This is not even close to true. Making open shots when you get them is always preferred to taking harder shots as the clock runs down.

You act like every shot he took since he didn't take his first open look he had to hoist it up with a man in his face. He shot the ball plenty of times wide open and missed the 3. Watch the UCLA game and many others.

 

[cincyguy13]

This is not even close to true. Making open shots when you get them is always preferred to taking harder shots as the clock runs down.

Once again, mick sees the guy practice every day. He knows who is good at shooting. If he was a great shooter, he would want him to shoot every open look he got. If he did tell Kyle to pull it back a notch, that's because he doesn't think that's are best way to win

 

[GarradJ21]

I think KW would be the first to tell you that he doesn't want to live behind the 3 point arc. He's more of a threat down low. He knows it's a bad shot within the first 5 seconds of a shotclock to shoot a 3 even though he does it sometimes as others do too.

 

[waterhead]

He was 0-3 against UCLA. WH my point is you indicated Mick told him to stop shooting them. I see know evidence to suggest that. Maybe Coach wanted the guys to be more selective in their shots. But no way did he tell Kyle to stop shooting them. asking players to be more selective is not a bad thing. The volume of his 3's indicate he really didn't change at all. Your eyeballs may be a bit off.

Just watch the games Waite. Go back and see if you see Kyle passing up a lot of shots early as opposed to last 5-10 games. He did not pass up shots early in the season and he did late...that's all I am saying. I don't think he should pass up wide open 3 point shots because he made a good % of them.

That's it...that's all I am saying.

I don't care how many he shot...just how many he passed up

 

[waterhead]

You act like every shot he took since he didn't take his first open look he had to hoist it up with a man in his face. He shot the ball plenty of times wide open and missed the 3. Watch the UCLA game and many others.

I am ONLY talking about wide open shots....and I don't care about the results from 1 game.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Just watch the games Waite. Go back and see if you see Kyle passing up a lot of shots early as opposed to last 5-10 games. He did not pass up shots early in the season and he did late...that's all I am saying. I don't think he should pass up wide open 3 point shots because he made a good % of them.

That's it...that's all I am saying.

I don't care how many he shot...just how many he passed up

OK

 

[jacobkdoyle]

This is not even close to true. Making open shots when you get them is always preferred to taking harder shots as the clock runs down.

Agree 100%. For most of Caupain's career people blamed his low FG% on our offense having to operate with a dwindling shot clock. Promoting that, and passing on open looks is a recipe for a bad offense.

 

[cincyguy13]

Agree 100%. For most of Caupain's career people blamed his low FG% on our offense having to operate with a dwindling shot clock. Promoting that, and passing on open looks is a recipe for a bad offense.

Shooting 3s with what most would say, someone that isn't a great shooter, is also a recipe for bad offense

 

[jacobkdoyle]

Shooting 3s with what most would say, someone that isn't a great shooter, is also a recipe for bad offense

Yeah obviously a lot more goes into all of this. No one is talking about drawing up looks for Washington 3s. I just generally won't complain if our bigs give it a couple tries if it's an open, rhythm, unforced shot. Washington shot 40% from 3 in AAC play and Clark was 36.7%. I don't so much care when they're taken if it's the right look.

 

[cincyguy13]

Yeah obviously a lot more goes into all of this. No one is talking about drawing up looks for Washington 3s. I just generally won't complain if our bigs give it a couple tries if it's an open, rhythm, unforced shot. Washington shot 40% from 3 in AAC play and Clark was 36.7%. I don't so much care when they're taken if it's the right look.

Yeah, I agree. I think they are both ok shooters. I don't think they are great or even good. For the ucla game, I would think we would want to try and get a better shot than a Washington 3 with 25 seconds on the shot clock. If we can't get a better shot than that, in that situation, thats a bigger problem

 

[waterhead]

Agree 100%. For most of Caupain's career people blamed his low FG% on our offense having to operate with a dwindling shot clock. Promoting that, and passing on open looks is a recipe for a bad offense.

This is almost precisely what I am talking about. We get late looks and Caupain has to take them driving down an already very average to bad 3 point %. Let Washington take some open 3's when it's available rather than waiting for the shot clock to wind down is more desirable to me.

Not to mention Evans passing up wide open looks when he is shooting over 40%. If it's open shoot the damn ball....I don't care if there is 25 seconds left.

If Washington shoots the ball more and his average slides under 35% from 3...then let's talk. If it's over that...let him take the wide open shot please.

 

[waterhead]

Here is the other thing I see with Kyle. He is not AFRAID to shoot in big games...nor does his % take a big hit. In fact his % when he took 3's in some big games was 44%. Perhaps that is better than most of the other guys on our team who shrunk in those same games.

14 of his 15 threes came against RI, ISU, Butler, Temple, Houston, Uconn, UCF, and SMU.

44%! 93% of his MADE 3's were against our better competition!!!!!!!!!!!!!

There is no question he was passing up open looks for the last 5-10 games. One of the only guys who had confidence enough to shoot and make them was likely being asked to find better shots.

Anyone who doesn't think this is a huge stat is probably kidding themselves. Almost every made 3 that Kyle took was against a pretty good team or in a close game.

Try to compare that against our other 3 point shooters to see what you come up with. It would almost appear to the naked eye that he excelled against good competition when he shot from range.

That is a mentality that we wish our whole team had in common IMO. If Kyle has that type of mentality...why not promote it in big games? Sometimes we see certain players who get timid in big/close games. If we have a guy who is up to the challenge...why would we want to limit his impact?

You can point to a singular game all you like (UCLA) but pointing to one game is lazy IMO.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Anyone who doesn't think this is a huge stat is probably kidding themselves. Almost every made 3 that Kyle took was against a pretty good team or in a close game.

Try to compare that against our other 3 point shooters to see what you come up with. It would almost appear to the naked eye that he excelled against good competition when he shot from range.

That is a mentality that we wish our whole team had in common IMO. If Kyle has that type of mentality...why not promote it in big games? Sometimes we see certain players who get timid in big/close games. If we have a guy who is up to the challenge...why would we want to limit his impact?

You can point to a singular game all you like (UCLA) but pointing to one game is lazy IMO.

Who limited him? Your trying to say he stopped shooting them because coach told him to. . He shot them at a better rate late in the year then he did early. Any thought given that he was defended differently. Lots of factors go into why. We may have been ahead and running clock. I really can't trust your eyeball teat. Sorry!

 

[cincyguy13]

Anyone who doesn't think this is a huge stat is probably kidding themselves. Almost every made 3 that Kyle took was against a pretty good team or in a close game.

Try to compare that against our other 3 point shooters to see what you come up with. It would almost appear to the naked eye that he excelled against good competition when he shot from range.

That is a mentality that we wish our whole team had in common IMO. If Kyle has that type of mentality...why not promote it in big games? Sometimes we see certain players who get timid in big/close games. If we have a guy who is up to the challenge...why would we want to limit his impact?

You can point to a singular game all you like (UCLA) but pointing to one game is lazy IMO.

We just don't think he is a great shooter like you. I think he's ok. He has shot 40 3s and you are comparing him to Logan and field Williams. Once again, if mick told him told him to not shoot so many 3s, like you said he did, why do you think that is? do you think mick tells great shooters to shot less?

 

[cincyguy13]

Who limited him?

Who and why? He never answers that

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Who and why? He never answers that

His assumption is based on what he thought he saw. He applied that to the coach telling him not to shoot. Very little context in his scenario. But that's my opinion.

 

[Jon Rycek]

I have not seen him play in person. Over the years, people tend to overhype incoming players. I hope he's great

Who?

 

[Jon Rycek]

Yeah, I agree. I think they are both ok shooters. I don't think they are great or even good. For the ucla game, I would think we would want to try and get a better shot than a Washington 3 with 25 seconds on the shot clock. If we can't get a better shot than that, in that situation, thats a bigger problem

Shot 40 percent and 36 percent and they're not even good?

 

[justinhub2003]

You are not going to find a better resume than that on our team against the best competition from the 3 point range I don't think. And if you do...I want to see them shooting more 3's.

When you look at Kenpom Tier A and Tier B games (Games in the top 50 and Top 100 when adjusted for location):

Kyle Shot: 33% from 3 against tier A&B teams

Against just our conference he shot: 40%

Also; of note:

In those Tier A&B games he had a total offensive rating of 91.3


91.3 against good competition is not stepping up. It means he was getting punked on the interior and had to get his shot by extending his range.

I like Kyle a ton. But to say Kyle shoots better from 3 in top games is misleading, especially when considering how inefficient he is offensively as a whole against good teams.

For context; Kyle shot 41% from 2 in A&B games. Thats horrible for a big. So he is getting nothing working down low and decided to stretch the D and hit a 3 of which he did 33% of the time.

Instead of him shooting more 3's, I'd rather him play better on the interior in those tough
games

 

[indydoug]

Kyle shot 43% from 3 for his first 29 games when he was allowed to select his shots. He was 0-7 for the last 7 games ending at 36% when the decision was taken from him. I do think he made a few bad decisions on the year from 3 but I think the message could have been more effectively communicated to him to allow him to continue to choose wiser decisions. I think out guards made bad selections at times too but the impact is unfairly magnified when a BIG makes the decision.

I think the decision to NOT allow him to shoot when he thought it was appropriate really killed his natural instinct and confidence. It's a fine line to let a player know when it's okay to shoot and basically telling them not to.

Hard to say 'decision was taken from him' when he took 35 3FG in first 29 games (1.2/g) and 7 in last 7 (1.0/g) although he did seem to hesitate more at the end of the year.