Bellarmine Exhibition

[Bearcat513]

A lot of areas need serious improvements.

I am honestly curious about what those areas are. Please elaborate.

edit: Haven't watched yet, plan on doing so sometime over the weekend so I want to see if I notice what you mean.

 

[waterhead]

Except that it is not just one game. He was very good in the intrasquad scrimmage. He was really good at Indiana State, and he was exceptional last night. And, per the head coach's own words, he's evidently been really good at the practices as well....i.e...most improved!

Also, for the record, what about my post on Monday night and Monday afternoon that Troy should play 40 minutes a game, implies that I think JJ should play ahead of Troy as everyone keeps accusing me of? The last time I looked, if a player plays 40 minutes a game, that means he never comes out. That is my stance. I do think that if we don't get JJ up to around 20 minutes a game, we might be making a mistake. He's looking pretty damn good all of a sudden. As long as Mick doesn't break him down again, he may be a big boost to this team.

I know you have said Troy should be on the court. I actually hope we can get Troy down to around 30 minutes for the first half of the season so he's not burnt out by the end. JJ's improvement will hopefully allow for that to happen. It will be interesting to see who get's the minutes between JJ and Cumberland this year. I think Evans and Troy will get 30+ and Kj will get 25+.

I agree that JJ is looking good so far. I thought he stayed on the ball pretty well too on D. No turn overs and some good passes...a little scoring. That's exactly what we need him to do. I am not concerned about moving TC over when JJ is in the game...TC will have opportunities to have the ball in his hands as well when that happens.

Big development if JJ plays like this all season IMO. Very good for the team and depth.

 

[waterhead]

The overreactions are out in full force. There was really only one important take away that I saw from the game. That was our reserves looked like they belonged. Loved Scott's energy, Quadri looked vastly improved, and Justin looked like he could be the 6th man. The improvement for JJ and Quad can not be overstated. The game looks like it has slowed down so much for them. My big concern was depth. This was a very positive development. The ragging on Troy, Gary, Jacob, Kyle, Kevin, and the coaching is just pointless. Mick said in his post game he specifically ran a defense so we would have to chase them around and get work in and Nysier didnt play because they didnt have a guy over 6'6 and everyone from Bellarmine was playing on the perimeter. It was a practice. I know what im getting out of our vets but I am really excited about the way our three questionable backups looked. JJ looked like a kid who could start which does wonders for our depth because we can move Troy over to the wing. Encouraging first game in my opinion.

I think we have plenty of players for depth. I was worried about finding quality depth. JJ, KJ, QM and JC scored 75% of our points. I would not have guessed that. In that regard I think the game was a success too! In fact some of the bench players could push for significant minutes. Namely Quadri and JJ...but I don't want to get ahead of myself. It's a long season and much tougher opponents ahead.

I wonder if Quadri starts against Brown?

 

[JackBauer151]

I think we have plenty of players for depth. I was worried about finding quality depth. JJ, KJ, QM and JC scored 75% of our points. I would not have guessed that. In that regard I think the game was a success too! In fact some of the bench players could push for significant minutes. Namely Quadri and JJ...but I don't want to get ahead of myself. It's a long season and much tougher opponents ahead.

I wonder if Quadri starts against Brown?

Im not sure either about how many minutes Quad and JJ will get but what I was so happy about was that if they are put in a position where they have to play extended minutes I feel so much more comfortable after watching that game. Justin's shot has improved and even more importantly his pace. Seemed like he was letting the game come to him. Quadri too for that matter. My opinion on the quality of depth rose significantly. I know it was just Bellarmine but it wasnt the competition they were playing. They just passed the eye test for me as two players who have significantly improved.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

I think we have plenty of players for depth. I was worried about finding quality depth. JJ, KJ, QM and JC scored 75% of our points. I would not have guessed that. In that regard I think the game was a success too! In fact some of the bench players could push for significant minutes. Namely Quadri and JJ...but I don't want to get ahead of myself. It's a long season and much tougher opponents ahead.

I wonder if Quadri starts against Brown?

Going into last night I thought our roster was basically:
Tier 1 - Clark, Caupain, Evans
Tier 2 - Washington, Johnson, Cumberland
Tier 3 - Moore, Brooks, Scott, Jenifer

I think it may be more:
Tier 1 - Clark, Caupain, Evans
Tier 2 - Johnson, Washington, Jenifer, Cumberland, Moore, Scott
Tier 3 - Brooks (matchup dependent...I still think he should've got in the game last night at least for a few minutes)

 

[waterhead]

I am honestly curious about what those areas are. Please elaborate.

edit: Haven't watched yet, plan on doing so sometime over the weekend so I want to see if I notice what you mean.

We need to make more shots...lol! 6 of 24 from the three point line isn't going to get it done. If we make 3 more of those the game is out of reach. Our bigs launched over 40% of those...not optimal. I am not worried about jaron's shot falling...I think he will be fine. It's pretty common for frosh to be a little jacked up.

 

[Madman81]

it's interesting that everyone noting how quadri hit a few shots in a meaningless exhibition game seemed to miss how he consistently got ******* demolished on defense.

once too slow for the level, always too slow for the level.

 

[waterhead]

Going into last night I thought our roster was basically:
Tier 1 - Clark, Caupain, Evans
Tier 2 - Washington, Johnson, Cumberland
Tier 3 - Moore, Brooks, Scott, Jenifer

I think it may be more:
Tier 1 - Clark, Caupain, Evans
Tier 2 - Johnson, Washington, Jenifer, Cumberland, Moore, Scott
Tier 3 - Brooks (matchup dependent...I still think he should've got in the game last night at least for a few minutes)

Good breakdown. I think Quadri could make a play for Deberry type minutes. It's one exhibition though...so we need to see a lot more action. We don't lose a scoring option when he's in the game so his defense will be key and he's been in the system so he knows where to be. Of course Washington and Scott have both been in the system for a year too but games are a different story. I doubt Quadri will give up more points on D vs Scott or Brooks than his offense will make up for.

 

[L-T]

I am honestly curious about what those areas are. Please elaborate.

edit: Haven't watched yet, plan on doing so sometime over the weekend so I want to see if I notice what you mean.

We need to "not" get out-rebounded by a Div. 2 team with nobody taller than 6'6". We left wide open shooters all night long.

 

[waterhead]

it's interesting that everyone noting how quadri hit a few shots in a meaningless exhibition game seemed to miss how he consistently got ******* demolished on defense.

once too slow for the level, always too slow for the level.

Washington had issues on D as well. Scott lost his man once or twice. Who knows on Brooks. Washington and Moore can score though...so they can offset deficiencies on D. I don't think Scott and Brooks are that far along on offense so they will have to be damn good on D.

Why can't we just get great defenders that are great on offense as well. Seems pretty simple...lol!!

 

[L-T]

it's interesting that everyone noting how quadri hit a few shots in a meaningless exhibition game seemed to miss how he consistently got ******* demolished on defense.

once too slow for the level, always too slow for the level.

He left his man open a few times, but didn't see anywhere near what you described about his defense. I think Washington was definitely benched for his defense. In fact, every time JJ and Quadri went out, Bellarmine made a run. Plus, Quadri had 8 rebounds. I guess he was slow enough to out-rebound Clark by 3 and I don't know if Washington got a rebound or not.

 

[justinhub2003]

Now that i've had a little time to think about last nights game.



1. I know some people are pretty glum on us only winning by 9 and scoring in the 60's but if you would ask me before the game if UC would win a game where evans sat out and Clark, Caupain and Washington combined for just 14 points and 12 rebounds, I would have thought you were nuts.

2. the least expected guys carried out scoring load. KJ played well, shot 4-9 and had just 2 TO in 35 minutes of action. Add in that he scored our last 7 points in the final 2 minutes, including a 3 and a layout that sealed the game

3. Justin Jenifer played with Passion and really wants to earn his role. He got a few ticky tack fouls called on him but he had just 1 TO in 26 minutes and shot the ball well. He plays that well all year and he ends up averaging 15mpg if not more

4. QUADRI MOORE: He is the kinda of player you root for to do well but also despise when he doesn't. He got lost on defense a few times but he also managed to still play really sound defense and was making plays on both ends. When I looked at our bench, i wondered who could legit score on it and Quadri now looks like the player he was supposed to be out of high school. Lets hope he stays this way.

5. I also really liked Tre Scott. IMO he isn't a huge factor this season but I do feel he wont take as long to blossom as some people think. He will block shots and play intensely BUT i also can see him being a bit of a gambler and getting beat a lot too.

6. Gary and Troy seemed a bit tired and disinterested (seriously though, i worry if TC has to play 39 minutes every game). Our two best players at protecting the ball combined for 6 TO's and Clark seemed to take over where Ellis left off with the travelling calls. Am I worried about either of them? No way. Both will come alive when we play Rhode Island

7. Kyle Washington: Man, I wanted him to do so well but he was a mess. On defense, he got caught sleeping and his man took him straight to the basket for an easy layup. Everyone says that the ball stops moving with KJ, but my guess is that Washington held the ball the longest when he was passed it. He is trying to do too much and part of me worries that he will be one of those players who has all the talent in the world in practice but when the lights come on, he forgets everything he was trying to do and just makes mistakes. Thats my initial impression but I expect him to work hard to change any bad impressions he had on UC fans.

8. Cumberland played like a freshman and yet played like an upper classman all at the same time. He gets beat on defense yet has a knack for swiping the ball and forcing TO's. IMO, by mid season, he will be the leading scorer off the bench.

 

[JackBauer151]

it's interesting that everyone noting how quadri hit a few shots in a meaningless exhibition game seemed to miss how he consistently got ******* demolished on defense.

once too slow for the level, always too slow for the level.

Quadri will always be too slow if he has to guard anyone on the perimeter. With the deficiencies of Kyle and Quadri I think we will see more of that matchup zone this year so guys like Kevin and Gary can bail them out when needed.

 

[waterhead]

We need to "not" get out-rebounded by a Div. 2 team with nobody taller than 6'6". We left wide open shooters all night long.

Rebounding was something I thought could have been much better too. That being said...the ball was bouncing their way a lot and sometimes that happens. We still should have out rebounded them so there were other issues than unlucky bounces. Sometimes you have to make your own luck by working harder than the other team. Bellarmine wanted it more and that is not acceptable. We should want to kick the crap out of every team we face.

I understand having an off night shooting but effort must always be there.

 

[justinhub2003]

Also of note:

Its gonna take a brave brave man to be the guy who tries to take a charge from Jarron Cumberland. He is a beast of a man

 

[jacobkdoyle]

Now that i've had a little time to think about last nights game.

* If you would have told me that UC can beat ANYONE if Evans wasn't playing and Clark, Caupain and Washington combined for just 14 points, it would be hard to believe.

1. I know some people are pretty glum on us only winning by 9 and scoring in the 60's but if you would ask me before the game if UC would win a game where evans sat out and Clark, Caupain and Washington combined for just 14 points and 12 rebounds, I would have thought you were nuts.

2. the least expected guys carried out scoring load. KJ played well, shot 4-9 and had just 2 TO in 35 minutes of action. Add in that he scored our last 7 points in the final 2 minutes, including a 3 and a layout that sealed the game

3. Justin Jenifer played with Passion and really wants to earn his role. He got a few ticky tack fouls called on him but he had just 1 TO in 26 minutes and shot the ball well. He plays that well all year and he ends up averaging 15mpg if not more

4. QUADRI MOORE: He is the kinda of player you root for to do well but also despise when he doesn't. He got lost on defense a few times but he also managed to still play really sound defense and was making plays on both ends. When I looked at our bench, i wondered who could legit score on it and Quadri now looks like the player he was supposed to be out of high school. Lets hope he stays this way.

5. I also really liked Tre Scott. IMO he isn't a huge factor this season but I do feel he wont take as long to blossom as some people think. He will block shots and play intensely BUT i also can see him being a bit of a gambler and getting beat a lot too.

6. Gary and Troy seemed a bit tired and disinterested (seriously though, i worry if TC has to play 39 minutes every game). Our two best players at protecting the ball combined for 6 TO's and Clark seemed to take over where Ellis left off with the travelling calls. Am I worried about either of them? No way. Both will come alive when we play Rhode Island

7. Kyle Washington: Man, I wanted him to do so well but he was a mess. On defense, he got caught sleeping and his man took him straight to the basket for an easy layup. Everyone says that the ball stops moving with KJ, but my guess is that Washington held the ball the longest when he was passed it. He is trying to do too much and part of me worries that he will be one of those players who has all the talent in the world in practice but when the lights come on, he forgets everything he was trying to do and just makes mistakes. Thats my initial impression but I expect him to work hard to change any bad impressions he had on UC fans.

8. Cumberland played like a freshman and yet played like an upper classman all at the same time. He gets beat on defense yet has a knack for swiping the ball and forcing TO's. IMO, by mid season, he will be the leading scorer off the bench.

I don't agree with #1. We should be able to beat Bellarmine with any 5 scholarship players. The talent gap is gigantic.

 

[justinhub2003]

I don't agree with #1. We should be able to beat Bellarmine with any 5 scholarship players. The talent gap is gigantic.

Sure.. But IMO Bellarmine would beat a lot of D1 schools. Especially with the way they shoot 3's and move without the ball. They are the best of the best of D2. The difference usually between D2 and D1 is size and athleticism but the D2 kids (at least top tier ones) are generally great shooters and play great fundamental basketball and its exactly what they did.

Im willing to bet that Brown goes down way way easier than Bellarmine did, with Evans or not. IMO Bellarmine would beat brown and probably give Albany a good game. But we will see soon as Bellarmine still has to play Louisville and Indiana and Ill be interested to see how they stack up with those 2 teams

 

[Madman81]

He left his man open a few times, but didn't see anywhere near what you described about his defense. I think Washington was definitely benched for his defense. In fact, every time JJ and Quadri went out, Bellarmine made a run. Plus, Quadri had 8 rebounds. I guess he was slow enough to out-rebound Clark by 3 and I don't know if Washington got a rebound or not.

it's not about his man scoring. he consistently gets beat during on-ball, face up defense. that man blows past him and drives the lane, creating the forced rotation and open look from outside.

happened numerous times throughout the game.

 

[Madman81]

Quadri will always be too slow

could have just ended this statement right here.

 

[GoCats88]

You're kidding right? Everyone who knows anything about basketball knows that one of the major negatives about playing zone is that it negatively impacts rebounding because you don't have an assigned man to box out. Please explain how playing zone would have neutralized their rebounding.

You are completely making an assumption when you imply that Caupain and Clark were uninterested. If they were uninterested, then they should be riding the bench against Brown. Evidently, the coach didn't feel Troy was playing uninterested. He played him 39 minutes. This forum will make every excuse possible for Troy. Maybe he just played poorly. I don't think a player who has such lofty expectations and is a senior, whose team hasn't accomplished jack during his career, would ever allow himself to be disinterested. If he was, then he's not the player you all claim he is.

Your logic is always the correct logic and your assumptions are always the correct assumptions it seems. Except you mainly back up all your statements with your own pure judgement. You've been and support for so many years. Well I'm pretty sure most of us have been. Thinking that jj is gonna be better than Troy is absurd. Believing tha Troy is gonna get shut down easily by a d2 team instead of him just being a little disinterested is crazy. Mick wasn't running a normal game plan, I think that was obvious. And all these people saying our season is gonna be terrible because of one exhibition game just makes me laugh. Haven't even seen our whole team on the court yet and some of you are already writing the season off. You say you support the kids despite the trash you talk about the ad and coaches, but then I continually here the same trash about the players. How about just some good old fashion true support for our team. Fans are as much to blame for the universities problems athletically anyway. When fan support waivers by the tens of thousands just because of a bad season or two, how do you expect a turn around.