Minutes/Game Going Forward

[waterhead]

Playing time is starting to get clearer over the last two games. Based on what we are seeing now here is a ball park of what we might expect going forward provided not a lot changes from guys like JDIII, DN, and Strickland. I would give these plus or minus 2 minutes unless we see a drastic change in one or two players.

SK...31 currently...I don't see this changing more than 2 minutes

TR...27 currently...probably pretty close

JJ...23.5...depends on fouls but this could go up 5

ST...22.5...seems about the right range for now

JS...22...I could see this dropping 5

JL...18...I could see this going up 5

TC...18...I think this is about right

GG...18...I would say 20 might be closer

KJ...12.5...I think this may be about right for him

DN...4...depends a lot on foul trouble and who we are playing

JDIII...4...if nothing changes it's not looking good

Tobler...2...doesn't really matter

Strickland...?...has not practiced so even if cleared I see redshirt

 

[TheLivingLegend]

I think that this rotation has to be cut down...

I also dont think JL should have 20 minutes a game. I simply havent seen anything that warrants it. Put back buckets vs small time competition doesnt do it for me. Defensively a liability, offensively a turnover machine. If Titus and Justin get in foul trouble we will not win.

 

[waterhead]

Here is what I am still perplexed about with JDIII. I just don't think this is all about D. Why?

Well, we see ST and JL getting beat at times and getting lost at times but Cronin likes them on the floor. His trigger is not as quick with them. JDIII played one minute in the last game and was pulled instantly.

There is offensive potential in all 3 of these guys...but JDIII gets the quick trigger treatment. Something else is going on unless JDIII is THAT much worse on D. Perhaps Cronin might feel ST and JL fit his style of play better, maybe it's an attitude thing, maybe it's an effort thing. It's hard to say...but JDIII has a much MUCH shorter leash.

Whatever it is, I am not the winningest D1 coach for my age, so I will defer to Cronin on this matter.

 

[TheLivingLegend]

Mick made a statement a few weeks ago that I thought was directly aimed at JDIII.

He was discussing player minutes and said those that continue to do things against my wishes and above there role will not play.

To me it made it sound like there are issues with how JDIII is doing things. Mick is going to get his way.

All speculation, but i agree, there is some sort of underlying issue going on. Offensively he may be the only guard that pushes the tempo, which is the style this team needs.

 

[Gotcha23]

I think that this rotation has to be cut down...

I also dont think JL should have 20 minutes a game. I simply havent seen anything that warrants it. Put back buckets vs small time competition doesnt do it for me. Defensively a liability, offensively a turnover machine. If Titus and Justin get in foul trouble we will not win.

JL has possibly the most potential on the team. The only way he reaches that potential is by playing. When we hit conference play and everyone is wearing down, we have a 6'9 swingman that can play off the bench. Quite frankly, I don't see what you're seeing...

 

[waterhead]

I think that this rotation has to be cut down...

I also dont think JL should have 20 minutes a game. I simply havent seen anything that warrants it. Put back buckets vs small time competition doesnt do it for me. Defensively a liability, offensively a turnover machine. If Titus and Justin get in foul trouble we will not win.

I am not sure we can cut the rotation down too much if we want to press the whole game. Maybe we could cut it to 8 and still have fresh legs when we need them.

As for Lawrence I think we need to give him the same benefit as KJ. He has shown a nice mid range shot...so it's not all put backs. He has't made that many but the same can be said for KJ. They will start to fall. This will limit his TO's if he starts to take more of these and less putting the ball on the floor in traffic. I agree his D needs to improve...but he is also getting plenty of rebounds and deflections.

I don't think we need to limit our rotation until our next three games are played and we meet stiffer competition. That is when mistakes will be amplified.

 

[waterhead]

Mick made a statement a few weeks ago that I thought was directly aimed at JDIII.

He was discussing player minutes and said those that continue to do things against my wishes and above there role will not play.

To me it made it sound like there are issues with how JDIII is doing things. Mick is going to get his way.

All speculation, but i agree, there is some sort of underlying issue going on. Offensively he may be the only guard that pushes the tempo, which is the style this team needs.

I think you are right. This could have been aimed at both JDIII and ST. He mentioned that ST doesn't understand his role on this team yet.

 

[TheLivingLegend]

JL has possibly the most potential on the team. The only way he reaches that potential is by playing. When we hit conference play and everyone is wearing down, we have a 6'9 swingman that can play off the bench. Quite frankly, I don't see what you're seeing...

Heres what I see
- Turnovers
- Fade aways
- No strength
- Awful Defense
- Bad hands

No doubt he has potential, but potential is a terrible word... For the record i do believe he will be good, I just think he has a long way to go.

All im saying is Titus and Justin HAVE to be in in big time games. They HAVE to play alot. Light years better then our other bigs. They cannot get in foul trouble.

 

[Gotcha23]

Heres what I see
- Turnovers
- Fade aways
- No strength
- Awful Defense
- Bad hands

No doubt he has potential, but potential is a terrible word... For the record i do believe he will be good, I just think he has a long way to go.

All im saying is Titus and Justin HAVE to be in in big time games. They HAVE to play alot. Light years better then our other bigs. They cannot get in foul trouble.

Does he play great defense??...no. But does he rebound?? YES. Who would you rather come off the bench and play the 3-5? I just don't see anyone better than him besides shaq, titus and JJ.

 

[CaptDale]

Does he play great defense??...no. But does he rebound?? YES. Who would you rather come off the bench and play the 3-5? I just don't see anyone better than him besides shaq, titus and JJ.

Maybe JJ, or however coached him, can coach JL to use the glass on his short jump shots. The hoop is a very exact target. The glass makes it a little easier to convert. JJ is living proof. Whoever schooled him over the summer, got way better results than he ever imagined.

 

[Robert]

Let me preface this by saying I respect the hell out of Mick Cronin, and he's a tremendous coach.

But what does putting JDIII in the game for a minute and yanking him do? Is it helping the team? Is it helpling JDIII?

I just don't get it. Guyn, Kilpatrick, and KJ are light years better on defense than JDIII. Caupain, however, hasn't done anything spectacular on defense. Why can JDIII only get on the floor for 1 minute when Caupain is playing 15+ minutes per game?

 

[CaptDale]

Let me preface this by saying I respect the hell out of Mick Cronin, and he's a tremendous coach.

But what does putting JDIII in the game for a minute and yanking him do? Is it helping the team? Is it helpling JDIII?

I just don't get it. Guyn, Kilpatrick, and KJ are light years better on defense than JDIII. Caupain, however, hasn't done anything spectacular on defense. Why can JDIII only get on the floor for 1 minute when Caupain is playing 15+ minutes per game?

JDIII's lone foul wasn't a reach in, it was just him guarding his man down the sideline and he got run into. Unfortunately, that's what the refs are calling these days. Unfortunately for JDIII, Mick yanked him before he even left footprints on the court. At the point of the foul, it was a tight defensive effort, but the guys are probably coached to back off if a potential bump looks imminent. Easier said than done. Last instructions Mick probably said, "Go in there and don't foul." Yank. Case closed. No appeal for JDIII. I don't like Mick's methodology in that respect, but he's being a little more tolerant with everyone else. Obviously, there's more to this than we peons know.

 

[waterhead]

Heres what I see
- Turnovers
- Fade aways
- No strength
- Awful Defense
- Bad hands

No doubt he has potential, but potential is a terrible word... For the record i do believe he will be good, I just think he has a long way to go.

All im saying is Titus and Justin HAVE to be in in big time games. They HAVE to play alot. Light years better then our other bigs. They cannot get in foul trouble.

Here is the interesting question between JL and JDIII. What does CRONIN see in them? I have to admit I have always wondered about JDIII. You see a lot of awful qualities in JL (at the moment...maybe not in the future) and from what I remember some possible potential in JDIII. What is it that you think either YOU or CRONIN is missing?

My guess is, and I am not trying to be disrespectful to you, that Cronin is the better judge of who should be on the floor. JL is simply giving Cronin more of what he wants on the floor...mistakes included.

 

[waterhead]

JDIII's lone foul wasn't a reach in, it was just him guarding his man down the sideline and he got run into. Unfortunately, that's what the refs are calling these days. Unfortunately for JDIII, Mick yanked him before he even left footprints on the court. At the point of the foul, it was a tight defensive effort, but the guys are probably coached to back off if a potential bump looks imminent. Easier said than done. Last instructions Mick probably said, "Go in there and don't foul." Yank. Case closed. No appeal for JDIII. I don't like Mick's methodology in that respect, but he's being a little more tolerant with everyone else. Obviously, there's more to this than we peons know.

Here is something I have been wondering. I seem to remember when Huggins was coach when we were pressing...I seem to remember us closing off the forward movement at the sideline either just before or just after half court. Then we move in from the side with the trap.

So far this year it seems like we are closing off the side but we aren't seeing the help closing off the forward movement on the sidelines. If we are going to trap...we have to do both. I was frustrated in the last game because we weren't doing this and I think it cost us. Either the players weren't doing thier jobs or Cronin forgot something. Judging by Cronin's post game reactions I am guessing it was the players...but how could they be on such seperate pages?

 

[waterhead]

We have been great forcing players to the sideline...but we have been horrible with trapping that player near the half court line from moving forward. Forcing the guy to the sideline is only half the battle and will rarely work if we aren't meeting him on the front side.

I kept thinking in the last game...how is just forcing him to the sidline helping if he keeps on going?

 

[waterhead]

Let me preface this by saying I respect the hell out of Mick Cronin, and he's a tremendous coach.

But what does putting JDIII in the game for a minute and yanking him do? Is it helping the team? Is it helpling JDIII?

I just don't get it. Guyn, Kilpatrick, and KJ are light years better on defense than JDIII. Caupain, however, hasn't done anything spectacular on defense. Why can JDIII only get on the floor for 1 minute when Caupain is playing 15+ minutes per game?

That is the main question. What else is going on with JDIII? Obviously there has to be something else. Cronin isn't stupid. As a matter of fact he seems to consider more aspects of the game than most. I wonder if he OVER thinks things but I am guessing he's done a thorough job of evaluation. After listening to some of his pressers I have come to find out he's thought things through SOOOOOO much more than I ever could. He...and most D1 coaches have a MUCH better grasp on what works than I or most fans could ever hope to. I defer to Mick on just about everything now without question.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

JL is 4 games into his college career. JDIII has been in the program for 2 plus years. Trying to compare their situations is laughable. Just as funny is debating the value of a player such as JDIII who has played limited minutes his freshman year. Coach has recruited for years. He knows talent when he sees it. He sees these guys everyday in practice. His skills as a recruiter were good enough to land jobs for both Huggins and Pitino. I mean really does anybody really believe they have enough info and experience to disagree with Mick as to who should get more minutes. If Davis doesn't like his situation he can try a couple different avenues. Work harder in practice and off season or transfer. Team is 4-0 don't think he would be missed all that much. The guys that are getting PT have obviously earned it as far as the coach sees it and that is all that counts. Until some on here identify themselves as D1 coaches or recruiters I think Mick deserves the benefit of the doubt.

 

[Robert]

JL is 4 games into his college career. JDIII has been in the program for 2 plus years. Trying to compare their situations is laughable. Just as funny is debating the value of a player such as JDIII who has played limited minutes his freshman year. Coach has recruited for years. He knows talent when he sees it. He sees these guys everyday in practice. His skills as a recruiter were good enough to land jobs for both Huggins and Pitino. I mean really does anybody really believe they have enough info and experience to disagree with Mick as to who should get more minutes. If Davis doesn't like his situation he can try a couple different avenues. Work harder in practice and off season or transfer. Team is 4-0 don't think he would be missed all that much. The guys that are getting PT have obviously earned it as far as the coach sees it and that is all that counts. Until some on here identify themselves as D1 coaches or recruiters I think Mick deserves the benefit of the doubt.

I don't disagree with the minutes distribution at all, really. JDIII is a subpar defender, and I have no problem with Guyn, Caupain, and Johnson getting more minutes. I was just questioning what good it does to put a guy in for one minute and then yank him the first time he makes a mistake, then never put him back in the game. Unless he's trying to prove a point (which I guess he is), I just don't think it helps the player or the team. But I do trust Cronin. We're all here to debate -- none of us are D1 coaches, but it makes following the program more fun.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

I don't disagree with the minutes distribution at all, really. JDIII is a subpar defender, and I have no problem with Guyn, Caupain, and Johnson getting more minutes. I was just questioning what good it does to put a guy in for one minute and then yank him the first time he makes a mistake, then never put him back in the game. Unless he's trying to prove a point (which I guess he is), I just don't think it helps the player or the team. But I do trust Cronin. We're all here to debate -- none of us are D1 coaches, but it makes following the program more fun.

I agree thanks for the response.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

I don't disagree with the minutes distribution at all, really. JDIII is a subpar defender, and I have no problem with Guyn, Caupain, and Johnson getting more minutes. I was just questioning what good it does to put a guy in for one minute and then yank him the first time he makes a mistake, then never put him back in the game. Unless he's trying to prove a point (which I guess he is), I just don't think it helps the player or the team. But I do trust Cronin. We're all here to debate -- none of us are D1 coaches, but it makes following the program more fun.

Robert my comment wasn't directed at you personnaly. Some on here had JDIII competing for the starting PG spot based off a few minutes they saw him perform his freshman year. He is a slow footed defender that would be taking on the defensive chores of guarding the quickest guy on the other team., the PG.That requires him to stop dribble drive penetration and keep him from getting the offense started for the other team. Its obvious that MC feels that its more important to get the younger players minutes based on the fact they at least have the physical tools to compete. Everyone wantd Mick to play a uptempo pressing style. It quite possible that JDIII skills are not a match for that style. Same with D Narsuk. right niow we haven't played a team with a big post presence. We ahve been able to play a small undersized 5 and get away with it. Before the season is out DN will be needed to give us some minutes against the other teams big man. These guys may see more minutes as the season goes on. My advice is keep working and improving you may be needed down the line. Its a long season.