Minutes/Game Going Forward

[Bearcat22]

I don't disagree with the minutes distribution at all, really. JDIII is a subpar defender, and I have no problem with Guyn, Caupain, and Johnson getting more minutes. I was just questioning what good it does to put a guy in for one minute and then yank him the first time he makes a mistake, then never put him back in the game. Unless he's trying to prove a point (which I guess he is), I just don't think it helps the player or the team. But I do trust Cronin. We're all here to debate -- none of us are D1 coaches, but it makes following the program more fun.

I should preface this by saying it's speculation and not based on inside knowledge, but I wonder if some of JDIII's lack of playing time is related to attitude, practice habits, work ethic, etc. With such a young team, Mick might be making the point to those guys that if you don't work hard you don't play no matter how long you've been in the program. I think Mick has made strides in creating the culture he's been wanting and he's going to be hyper-vigilant about protecting it.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

I should preface this by saying it's speculation and not based on inside knowledge, but I wonder if some of JDIII's lack of playing time is related to attitude, practice habits, work ethic, etc. With such a young team, Mick might be making the point to those guys that if you don't work hard you don't play no matter how long you've been in the program. I think Mick has made strides in creating the culture he's been wanting and he's going to be hyper-vigilant about protecting it.

Bearcat22 bottom line is MC is going to play the guys who he thinks gives the team the best chance to win. For whatever reason JDIII has not convinced the coach that he is capable of performing at that level. He sees him everyday in practice and has for over 2 years. All the free JDIII banter should be directed at the player himself. Work hard,improve your game and earn more playing time. Convince the coach you deserve more run. That all starts in practice. In a profession like coaching that requires winning to keep your job burying players who could help to improve your chances is not a very practical approach to achieving success. It actually is more slanted the other direction were the better players are given more rope then the marginal guys.

 

[CaptDale]

Bearcat22 bottom line is MC is going to play the guys who he thinks gives the team the best chance to win. For whatever reason JDIII has not convinced the coach that he is capable of performing at that level. He sees him everyday in practice and has for over 2 years. All the free JDIII banter should be directed at the player himself. Work hard,improve your game and earn more playing time. Convince the coach you deserve more run. That all starts in practice. In a profession like coaching that requires winning to keep your job burying players who could help to improve your chances is not a very practical approach to achieving success. It actually is more slanted the other direction were the better players are given more rope then the marginal guys.

Exactly right, Waite. The only problem with the quick hook for JDIII is that Mick has now destroyed what little (if any) confidence the kid has/had. He's now a deficit in his own mind. If it was me, I'd transfer if I had any down the line aspirations. Playing on the team is hard work and very time consuming. I'm sure he could play a lot of places, but, barring any player injuries, he's going to be getting lots of splinters from the bench - just like Zach (our token).

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Exactly right, Waite. The only problem with the quick hook for JDIII is that Mick has now destroyed what little (if any) confidence the kid has/had. He's now a deficit in his own mind. If it was me, I'd transfer if I had any down the line aspirations. Playing on the team is hard work and very time consuming. I'm sure he could play a lot of places, but, barring any player injuries, he's going to be getting lots of splinters from the bench - just like Zach (our token).

captdale ,you do know its possible that JDIII has created his own predicament. Sometimes after all other methods have been exhausted tough love is a last resort. JDIII may be the responsible party for his predicament. Mick may have lite a fire in him. If not it may be time for him to go. I hope he is the type of kid who uses his situation as motivation and responds accordingly. If not it's not micks fault but JDIII. Accountability my friend it's a wonderful thing.

 

[Patrick Bateman]

Exactly right, Waite. The only problem with the quick hook for JDIII is that Mick has now destroyed what little (if any) confidence the kid has/had. He's now a deficit in his own mind. If it was me, I'd transfer if I had any down the line aspirations. Playing on the team is hard work and very time consuming. I'm sure he could play a lot of places, but, barring any player injuries, he's going to be getting lots of splinters from the bench - just like Zach (our token).

What did Eric Hicks do when he was suspended for behavior? What about Tony Bobbitt? They responded, big time. Maybe Mick is trying to light a fire under JD3 and see what he is really made of.

 

[Bearcat22]

Bearcat22 bottom line is MC is going to play the guys who he thinks gives the team the best chance to win. For whatever reason JDIII has not convinced the coach that he is capable of performing at that level. He sees him everyday in practice and has for over 2 years. All the free JDIII banter should be directed at the player himself. Work hard,improve your game and earn more playing time. Convince the coach you deserve more run. That all starts in practice. In a profession like coaching that requires winning to keep your job burying players who could help to improve your chances is not a very practical approach to achieving success. It actually is more slanted the other direction were the better players are given more rope then the marginal guys.

I like your point about the pressure of winning and that coaches will play the guys that give them the best chance to do so - which makes total sense. I think there's more to it though. It seems that coaches must also perform a risk management role for their team. Hypothetically, if JDIII were having attitude problems but was a dominant player he would probably see the court more than he does now. If the on the court performance doesn't exceed the grief he causes Mick in addition to the effect on a young team, he's not going to play. It hasn't been until recently that Mick has had the depth to do so. Gates and Bishop were disciplined at times but the on court performance, plus the lack of other available options, lead to them playing more (and Bishop being welcomed back on the team). It would be unfair to say those two didn't work hard to get back on the court too. In some ways it's like Jimmy Johnson's approach with the Dallas Cowboys. Michal Irvin got more latitude for behavioral issue than for instance the back-up fullback.

 

[CaptDale]

captdale ,you do know its possible that JDIII has created his own predicament. Sometimes after all other methods have been exhausted tough love is a last resort. JDIII may be the responsible party for his predicament. Mick may have lite a fire in him. If not it may be time for him to go. I hope he is the type of kid who uses his situation as motivation and responds accordingly. If not it's not micks fault but JDIII. Accountability my friend it's a wonderful thing.

I guess we'll never know what goes on behind the scenes unless an insider airs the dirty laundry. That's why this thread has so much speculative rhetoric and conjecture on it.

 

[Scheids21]

I guess we'll never know what goes on behind the scenes unless an insider airs the dirty laundry. That's why this thread has so much speculative rhetoric and conjecture on it.

I will give you credit just for using the phrase "speculative rhetoric and conjecture".

 

[Robert]

I will give you credit just for using the phrase "speculative rhetoric and conjecture".

Your 1,000th post and you are giving someone else credit. What a team player!

 

[CaptDale]

I will give you credit just for using the phrase "speculative rhetoric and conjecture".

That's because I went to UC
Unfortunately, I skipped most of my classes but still graduated (I have no idea how).

 

[david aka the TYZ]

I don't get what everybody has seen in JDIII to get in such an uproar about. He seems like he can score, but only in garbage time without any real offense being run. Honestly he seems like a selfish player to me on the court. The second game when he got in late he put his head down when he got the ball and dribbled around until he took a contested shot, not even looking to pass. On defense he seems clueless. And the foul he commited in the game last night was a blatant reach in on a ball handler. He pouts on the bench and seems disinterested. When you are getting so precious few minutes these are things you don't do. This guy practices as many minutes as every other player on the team for Cronin to make an assessment of his game. I don't think he doesn't get in the games because he makes mistakes, I think he doesn't get in the game because he doesn't do what Cronin expects of him. And part of that is when you make a mistake, learn from it and stop doing it. The freshman are getting playing time and making mistakes. Young guys have to make mistakes to learn from them. I'm guessing they are showing signs of adjusting their games and learning. Cronin, as much as he hates guys making mistakes, knows that the freshman are going to come in and do dumb things and get turnovers. When they do that and they come off the floor, he or an assistant goes over to them and explains what they did wrong or why what they did led to a turnover or a foul. When JDIII gets in there I'm sure Cronin has told him what he expects of him and he is not living up to that. Every other player on this team knows Cronin's expectations of them and if they are getting minutes then they must be owning up to that. I for one am not concerned with why JDIII isn't playing.

 

[Nomadic1]

I like your point about the pressure of winning and that coaches will play the guys that give them the best chance to do so - which makes total sense. I think there's more to it though. It seems that coaches must also perform a risk management role for their team. Hypothetically, if JDIII were having attitude problems but was a dominant player he would probably see the court more than he does now. If the on the court performance doesn't exceed the grief he causes Mick in addition to the effect on a young team, he's not going to play. It hasn't been until recently that Mick has had the depth to do so. Gates and Bishop were disciplined at times but the on court performance, plus the lack of other available options, lead to them playing more (and Bishop being welcomed back on the team). It would be unfair to say those two didn't work hard to get back on the court too. In some ways it's like Jimmy Johnson's approach with the Dallas Cowboys. Michal Irvin got more latitude for behavioral issue than for instance the back-up fullback.

I think in Yancy's case, he was given "latitude" because of the situation he was thrown into. His problems weren't basketball related. Kid produced right away, he just wasn't a larger version of Danny Fortson(which I think is what people expected).
Bishop I'd give you. I mean, he didn't average a ton of points but he had a good handle, good defense, could shoot and did the grunt work. Certainly ready for the college game. I kind of miss watching him play.

 

[waterhead]

I don't get what everybody has seen in JDIII to get in such an uproar about. He seems like he can score, but only in garbage time without any real offense being run. Honestly he seems like a selfish player to me on the court. The second game when he got in late he put his head down when he got the ball and dribbled around until he took a contested shot, not even looking to pass. On defense he seems clueless. And the foul he commited in the game last night was a blatant reach in on a ball handler. He pouts on the bench and seems disinterested. When you are getting so precious few minutes these are things you don't do. This guy practices as many minutes as every other player on the team for Cronin to make an assessment of his game. I don't think he doesn't get in the games because he makes mistakes, I think he doesn't get in the game because he doesn't do what Cronin expects of him. And part of that is when you make a mistake, learn from it and stop doing it. The freshman are getting playing time and making mistakes. Young guys have to make mistakes to learn from them. I'm guessing they are showing signs of adjusting their games and learning. Cronin, as much as he hates guys making mistakes, knows that the freshman are going to come in and do dumb things and get turnovers. When they do that and they come off the floor, he or an assistant goes over to them and explains what they did wrong or why what they did led to a turnover or a foul. When JDIII gets in there I'm sure Cronin has told him what he expects of him and he is not living up to that. Every other player on this team knows Cronin's expectations of them and if they are getting minutes then they must be owning up to that. I for one am not concerned with why JDIII isn't playing.

I can't say why JDIII isn't getting more minutes...but at this point I am going to stop wondering. Cronin has selected his team...and right now JDIII isn't a part of it. I will let Cronin decide how to answer this if he even wants to which I doubt he does.

I have always wondered but I am going to stop right now.

 

[waterhead]

Here is what I would like to see as a fan (in a perfect world) at this point. Taking what I feel (as a fan) I would like to see on the court...and hedging that against what Cronin sees.

SK...32.5

JJ...32.5...if he can stay out of foul trouble

TR...28

ST...25 (maybe more)

JL...25...provided he keeps getting better

GG...20

TC...18...could stand to see more of him

JS...12.5

KJ...12.5 (maybe more)

JDIII...this one I defer to Cronin

Strickland...Depends on eligibility

DN...5 or less

Tobler...I am hoping for 5 becuase that means we are killin it

 

[Gotcha23]

I can't say why JDIII isn't getting more minutes...but at this point I am going to stop wondering. Cronin has selected his team...and right now JDIII isn't a part of it. I will let Cronin decide how to answer this if he even wants to which I doubt he does.

I have always wondered but I am going to stop right now.

Yea I'm not sure why the fans continue to discuss JD. Obviously the kid isn't better than Troy or Guyn, if he was he'd be in the game. I'm not real sure JDIII will be here next year. We all saw how the Gaines situation shaped out.