Undefeated SMU @ Moody

[jacobkdoyle]

Maybe Cumberland won't be scared of the moment (assuming he actually gets on the floor over an upperclassman).

 

[jacobkdoyle]

All I am suggesting are ways I think we can change the pattern and for some reason I am considered delusional

Not saying you're delusional. I just think you're trying awfully hard to diagnose something that seems to me to be a clear case of a team that is mentally weak. You either have guys with guts, or you don't. I'm thinking we don't. Could that change? I guess. Not sure how or why I'd believe it before I see it though.

 

[UCalum08]

UC basketball...close but no cigar.

Close only counts in horseshoe and hand grenades. For once, I am questioning the quality of our program too.

 

[Cin City]

It is disheartening as all hell to watch another close game go to the other team. Especially when, like Butler and IA. ST., it was ours to lose. And lose we did.

So we sit at 11-5 when most of us probably had it penciled in that after 16 games we would be no worse than 14-2 or 13-3.

Like most, I am crushed.

But, it's just not in me to quit believing. Over the next 10 games we will have a REAL idea of the mettle our guys are made of. Looking at the schedule, @UCONN and @ Memphis look like tough games. How would you react at an 8-2 record over those 10? that would put us at 19-7. Is it what we would have predicted to start the season? Maybe. Maybe not.

My point is that the season is young enough to still gel and become the team we all thought we would be this year. Of course, on the flip side we could see some head scratching losses and go 6-4 or 5-5 and by then will have played ourselves out of any tourney talk.

But only time will tell.

Stay the course gentlemen. At the end of the day, as fans, we are in this together because we love our Bearcats.

I'm all for seeing it play out. I BELIEVE it will turn for the better. I have to.

 

[jds513]

Yeah. If you go by 247, they've rated Cumberland at #37. I think McClain and Wilks might have been close (more like top 75).

Yancy Gates

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Like most very disappointed in our inability to close out games. We have demonstrated we can play with most teams but can not beat them to this point.

After watching the game some things are obvious.

1. The officiating we have seen in the last two games has been incredibly one sided. Ellis shot our 3 and 4 FT's very late in game. The disparity in our fouls as opposed to our opposition is staggering.

2. Folks we are a mid major our league,facilities and performance scream that.

3. Mick has done a good job getting us back on good footing. After next year if I was him I would tell my agent it's time to leave. I think fan base and him would benefit tremendously.

 

[bearcatbacker82]

Like most very disappointed in our inability to close out games. We have demonstrated we can play with most teams but can not beat them to this point.

After watching the game some things are obvious.

1. The officiating we have seen in the last two games has been incredibly one sided. Ellis shot our 3 and 4 FT's very late in game. The disparity in our fouls as opposed to our opposition is staggering.

2. Folks we are a mid major our league,facilities and performance scream that.

3. Mick has done a good job getting us back on good footing. After next year if I was him I would tell my agent it's time to leave. I think fan base and him would benefit tremendously.

That officiating was ridiculous. We definitely helped them by running stupid sets and jacking up dumb shots but they could not have won with the officials making uneven calls. This is supposed to be a new year off officiating were hand checks get called but I saw numerous times the calls weren't made......

 

[Doogle]

Doogle, I always look forward to your comments. You're one of the best on here. I've been a season ticket holder for an incredibly long time. I'm dying a slow death right now. My dad got us our season tickets when I was 8 and it's been an obsession for me ever since. But, this coach is draining me. I really hate the thought of giving these seats up, but I'm as close as I've ever been. The cost is just so high when compared to the amount of enjoyment I'm getting these days. This season started so promising. I was sure that we were taking that next step. Little did I know the step was going to be down. Very disappointing!

Thanks L-T. Everyone that posts here does a good job of combining analysis with a fan's passion. It ain't always easy for any of us.

 

[Doogle]

Agreed on the foul disparity. Thought to myself at halftime that subconsciously the refs would try and protect SMU since they were down to 6 guys. Seemed like that was happening.

But like y'all have been saying, they convert an any one or two chances at the end with good execution and they win the game. So it's hard to completely blast the officials. It's happened 3 times this year. Common denominator is the team with "Cincinnati" on the jersey.

 

[cincycpaw]

Caupain did not score in the second half going 0-5.

This team does not have a closer like a SK or Logan who can take the ball and get fouled. These games have been there for the taking and nobody wants to step up and make it happen.

Pretty disappointing that a veteran UC team lost to Larry Brown with 6 players when UC got 18 more shots than SMU.

I agree that this team lacks a true closer. And it has always been my fear with the way this program had been going. Moving towards more balanced scoring....which is great...but you always need at least that 1 guy who wants the ball at the end and can get his shot. I still think Troy can get there. I had thought early in his career maybe Shaq would. I do think Evans has a chance to be that guy. But it is certainly missing from todays team and its why they are losing.

I will say, that the dumbest thing Cronin ever did was punish Troy for his swagger and taunting in the UCONN game at home....that was the Troy we need....and he killed him just as soon as we got him. Stupid Stupid Stupid. If it was someone with a history of that behavior (I'm looking at you Ellis), then you have to do something. If it's a mild mannered kid you want more from, you tell him you love the passion and keep it, just play with it and talk less and let him go on.

 

[Basketball.com]

Maybe Cumberland won't be scared of the moment (assuming he actually gets on the floor over an upperclassman).

It's not even a matter of weather not he'd be scared, if he is ranked 37 he should not come to Cincinnati and play under Mick Cronin, Mick will dumb him down talk to him bad! Now if Mick is no longer the coach then yes he should come! Mick need to stop bitching and win a close game! How do you have your whole team back and look like we look! Coach Davis got a better response from these young men, why because of the way he communicated with them! Mick can raise good money for the University of Cincinnati Basketball team but can't coach a lick of College basketball.

 

[Doogle]

15 years ago, everyone I knew thought Mick would be a wonderful replacement for Huggs someday. He took some shots for jumping ship to Pitino but I thought it was a brilliant play. Huggs' assistants were getting little to no juice for HC jobs. Why not light yourself up with Pitino's star? Combine Huggs' defensive acumen with Pitino's rep for offense and you've got a well-rounded Coach with a great pedigree.

Mick's Murray teams were fun to watch. And listening to his postgame last night, his teams were once 64-1 with a lead in the final minutes.

I believe Mick is a good coach. I don't know him personally. I don't know how hard he works, recruits or plans. I'm not in practice. So take my opinion as simply that.

I think a couple of things are at work here:
1) The early years beat him down. Fielding a JV team that first season or two changed him in some fundamental way and altered his philosophies. Getting "athletes" became a priority. Slowing tempo and reducing possessions got coded into his DNA. Playing Seniors, etc. Coaches are control freaks by nature. Losing exacerbates the quality.
2) He's not getting any constructive criticism/dissent from his assistants or his bosses. Everyone is grateful to him for resurrecting the program. His assistants are loyal and have been with him for a long time. Do any of them ever disagree with him? Are they so deep in the foxhole together that they can't see outside it anymore?

I had a boss once tell me (upon completion of a project that I worked very hard on, but not very well) that I was too close to the project; take a step back, see it for what it was with an open mind, and fix it. Some of the best advice I've ever gotten. Coaches rarely get the opportunity to do this. Was hoping Mick would gain that perspective from his time away last year...but maybe he never really took a full step back? Hard to say.

I'm not laying full blame for the season so far at Mick's feet. The players on the floor have had ample opportunity to win 4 of the 5 games they've lost. Caupain was supposed to drive to the hole last night and he surprised Cobb with a pass. Caupain blew the sequence at the end of the Iowa State game as well. Is that on Mick? Yes and no. It's his decision to put the ball in Troy's hands. Troy continues to fail in that role. Might his faith in Troy be rewarded? Time will tell.

My issue is not with his choice of starters. It's with the development of guys who could help this year and will be relied upon in years to come. Jenifer has to be deployed in some fashion, in every game. He's the pure PG we've coveted. There's no obvious reason not to give him playing time and learn through attrition. If we're a possession basketball team, fine. But I'd love to see us start those possessions with 26-27 seconds on the clock instead of 20. Watching Troy literally be on the only guy on one side of the court and walk the ball across the timeline, using 8-10 seconds of a 30 second clock is maddening. No logical reason to do this. We need Jenifer's change of pace if nothing else. Mick has to take his head out of the sand and realize this.

Back to my day job.

 

[L-T]

Most corporations create a mission statement that defines the expectations or purpose of the organization. I would be interested in reading our mission statement, if one exists. If our mission is to be an elite basketball power in college basketball that closely aligns with where our historical standing/tradition places us...Top 10-20 all-time, then Mick Cronin needs to go. If we're happy and content with Top 25-50 status, being a nice mid-major program, rarely winning a league championship, but making the NCAA nearly every year, with no real hope of advancing much past the 1st weekend, then Mick is our guy and he is brilliant at it. If we could all see that Bearcat Basketball mission statement, we could probably eliminate 99% of the arguments and bad blood in here. We could handle a loss on the road to SMU, or the occasional loss to a .500 team at home. Based on the millions spent on Bearcat Village, the Bubble, Nippert, and now the Shoe, it would appear that the mission is much higher than mid-major status in all sports, especially football and basketball. If that's the case, you can't have a coach who has peaked at mid-major, when your mission is "Elite". Rick Minter was a classic mid-major coach and we moved him on, in spite of him turning our football program around and achieving bowl status numerous times. I thought that was a mistake getting rid of him, but I was wrong. I see the exact same scenario with Mick Cronin. Again, what is our mission?

 

[UCBearcats]

Most corporations create a mission statement that defines the expectations or purpose of the organization. I would be interested in reading our mission statement, if one exists. If our mission is to be an elite basketball power in college basketball that closely aligns with where our historical standing/tradition places us...Top 10-20 all-time, then Mick Cronin needs to go. If we're happy and content with Top 25-50 status, being a nice mid-major program, rarely winning a league championship, but making the NCAA nearly every year, with no real hope of advancing much past the 1st weekend, then Mick is our guy and he is brilliant at it. If we could all see that Bearcat Basketball mission statement, we could probably eliminate 99% of the arguments and bad blood in here. We could handle a loss on the road to SMU, or the occasional loss to a .500 team at home. Based on the millions spent on Bearcat Village, the Bubble, Nippert, and now the Shoe, it would appear that the mission is much higher than mid-major status in all sports, especially football and basketball. If that's the case, you can't have a coach who has peaked at mid-major, when your mission is "Elite". Rick Minter was a classic mid-major coach and we moved him on, in spite of him turning our football program around and achieving bowl status numerous times. I thought that was a mistake getting rid of him, but I was wrong. I see the exact same scenario with Mick Cronin. Again, what is our mission?

Nailed it!

 

[L-T]

15 years ago, everyone I knew thought Mick would be a wonderful replacement for Huggs someday. He took some shots for jumping ship to Pitino but I thought it was a brilliant play. Huggs' assistants were getting little to no juice for HC jobs. Why not light yourself up with Pitino's star? Combine Huggs' defensive acumen with Pitino's rep for offense and you've got a well-rounded Coach with a great pedigree.

Mick's Murray teams were fun to watch. And listening to his postgame last night, his teams were once 64-1 with a lead in the final minutes.

I believe Mick is a good coach. I don't know him personally. I don't know how hard he works, recruits or plans. I'm not in practice. So take my opinion as simply that.

I think a couple of things are at work here:
1) The early years beat him down. Fielding a JV team that first season or two changed him in some fundamental way and altered his philosophies. Getting "athletes" became a priority. Slowing tempo and reducing possessions got coded into his DNA. Playing Seniors, etc. Coaches are control freaks by nature. Losing exacerbates the quality.
2) He's not getting any constructive criticism/dissent from his assistants or his bosses. Everyone is grateful to him for resurrecting the program. His assistants are loyal and have been with him for a long time. Do any of them ever disagree with him? Are they so deep in the foxhole together that they can't see outside it anymore?

I had a boss once tell me (upon completion of a project that I worked very hard on, but not very well) that I was too close to the project; take a step back, see it for what it was with an open mind, and fix it. Some of the best advice I've ever gotten. Coaches rarely get the opportunity to do this. Was hoping Mick would gain that perspective from his time away last year...but maybe he never really took a full step back? Hard to say.

I'm not laying full blame for the season so far at Mick's feet. The players on the floor have had ample opportunity to win 4 of the 5 games they've lost. Caupain was supposed to drive to the hole last night and he surprised Cobb with a pass. Caupain blew the sequence at the end of the Iowa State game as well. Is that on Mick? Yes and no. It's his decision to put the ball in Troy's hands. Troy continues to fail in that role. Might his faith in Troy be rewarded? Time will tell.

My issue is not with his choice of starters. It's with the development of guys who could help this year and will be relied upon in years to come. Jenifer has to be deployed in some fashion, in every game. He's the pure PG we've coveted. There's no obvious reason not to give him playing time and learn through attrition. If we're a possession basketball team, fine. But I'd love to see us start those possessions with 26-27 seconds on the clock instead of 20. Watching Troy literally be on the only guy on one side of the court and walk the ball across the timeline, using 8-10 seconds of a 30 second clock is maddening. No logical reason to do this. We need Jenifer's change of pace if nothing else. Mick has to take his head out of the sand and realize this.

Back to my day job.

Doogle, amazing post! Keep posting. I feel better every time I read what you have to say. Really good stuff.

 

[Cin City]

Maybe I'm in the minority here and that's fine, but if we step back and look at the season thus far we have 3 losses to top 15 teams by a combined 6 points.

Did we choke? Maybe.

Did the "proverbial" basketball gods frown upon us? Depe4nds on if you believe that kind of thing.

It's not ideal right now, but it's not the seasons end.

Can we fix it? Yes. I don't know if it will be fixed or not but it CAN be fixed.

I get aggravated watching us this year too, but I'll wait with the stones in my hand, until the seasons end, before casting them.

 

[cincrulz11]

I don't know if this has been discussed here cause I haven't read anything since last night and there seems to be a ton to read and honestly I just don't feel like it.


But you have to wonder how much Mick has changed with what happened last year. Is that extra fire, the me vs the word intensity gone? Something is different and it doesn't appear to be for the good of the basketball program.


Maybe Mick just made a massive mistake in judging his own team. His philosophy with them has not been correct at all. Ellis has been extremely disappointing all year, Caupain has decided to follow that the past couple weeks. DeBerry has been very bad when he's played. Our entire hope for this year was that Ellis would be dominant and the others would improve. Ellis has regressed. He hurt the team yesterday.



Variance is also showing up. Mick had that insane record in close games when we held the lead late, that couldn't hold up forever. Sucks it's hitting now.

 

[cincrulz11]

Maybe I'm in the minority here and that's fine, but if we step back and look at the season thus far we have 3 losses to top 15 teams by a combined 6 points.

Did we choke? Maybe.

Did the "proverbial" basketball gods frown upon us? Depe4nds on if you believe that kind of thing.

It's not ideal right now, but it's not the seasons end.

Can we fix it? Yes. I don't know if it will be fixed or not but it CAN be fixed.

I get aggravated watching us this year too, but I'll wait with the stones in my hand, until the seasons end, before casting them.

The problem is we've basically put ourselves in a spot where we have to win the conference tournament to make the tournament. There are no wins to be had in this league. Last night was really a must for this team. We have smu again, but that probably won't be enough unless we do something crazy like run the table. And who can see that happening from this squad.

 

[waterhead]

Not saying you're delusional. I just think you're trying awfully hard to diagnose something that seems to me to be a clear case of a team that is mentally weak. You either have guys with guts, or you don't. I'm thinking we don't. Could that change? I guess. Not sure how or why I'd believe it before I see it though.

Whatever it is...it wouldn't be a huge adjustment to pull out three 2 point losses. I can't blame it on anything specific. Closing out a game is certainly an issue that would help. But there are a host of other things we could get slightly better at which should produce similar results.

We do need to be able to perform at crunch time. The coach needs to get a little better at drawing up those plays or who gets the ball and why. So far whatever his plan is....isn't working. That last play was horrendous...it looked like it was drawn up but Cronin was suggesting it wasn't what he wanted. Apparently Caupain is winging shit out there and the coach isn't on board. That's a huge problem that can be solved in 2 seconds. Draw up a f-ing play and tell the player exactly what you want!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[cincrulz11]

Watching Troy literally be on the only guy on one side of the court and walk the ball across the timeline, using 8-10 seconds of a 30 second clock is maddening. No logical reason to do this. We need Jenifer's change of pace if nothing else. Mick has to take his head out of the sand and realize this.

The problem with this is Mick will either get Jenifer to slowly walk the ball up, or Jenifer will go quicker because that's what he does, and then Mick will have him stand just across half court for 10 seconds. This is the way Mick demands his offense be ran. Who the f knows why.