DontMissHim
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 2, 2010
- Messages
- 807
Great argument. I mean to call UC a basketball school is ridiculous, 50 years ago since winning a NC. I can't seem to remember right now, when was the last time UC football won the NC?
Big East expanding
- Thread starter ralph1950
- Start date
Help Support BearcatTalk:
Great argument. I mean to call UC a basketball school is ridiculous, 50 years ago since winning a NC. I can't seem to remember right now, when was the last time UC football won the NC?
JasonS
Football Moderator
Can we get back on topic? I don't care if UC is a "football school" or "basketball school" or just a school. Let's talk about UC and it's place in the Big East or another conference. Until someone can produce something proving UC was offered a spot in the Big 12 and declined (and I don't want speculation or "based on comments from the President" unless the President says "we turned down an offer from the Big 12"), let's stay away from that too. Ok?
We have some new info today about schools that the Big East is targeting to expand potentially to 12 schools. I'd love to hear people's thoughts on those schools and that situation.
Thanks!
We have some new info today about schools that the Big East is targeting to expand potentially to 12 schools. I'd love to hear people's thoughts on those schools and that situation.
Thanks!
bearcat jeff
Hoops Moderator
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2010
- Messages
- 7,502
Per ESPN at 2:40 this afternoon:
Navy, Air Force and Army are among the schools that have been mentioned for potential football-only membership. Memphis, Central Florida, East Carolina and Temple have been brought up as candidates as well, and Villanova could move up to the FBS level.
http://www.espn1530.com/pages/lancesBlog.html
Navy, Air Force and Army are among the schools that have been mentioned for potential football-only membership. Memphis, Central Florida, East Carolina and Temple have been brought up as candidates as well, and Villanova could move up to the FBS level.
http://www.espn1530.com/pages/lancesBlog.html
Thegreatone
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 2, 2010
- Messages
- 3,187
If the only standard is National titles than there are a lot of schools that will be hurting to be anything. That is a stupid arguement.
Conference titles are a far better indication.
In the 90's and early 2000's it was clear UC was a basketball school.
The last 5 years there is NO doubt UC has been a football school. I think going forward it is going to be the balence will start to balence back out to around even.
Conference titles are a far better indication.
In the 90's and early 2000's it was clear UC was a basketball school.
The last 5 years there is NO doubt UC has been a football school. I think going forward it is going to be the balence will start to balence back out to around even.
bearcat jeff
Hoops Moderator
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2010
- Messages
- 7,502
Calhoun on moving to the ACC and Boston Colleges resistance to it:
When Boston College participated in Big East strategizing sessions in 2003 only to covertly depart for the ACC weeks later, UConn coach Jim Calhoun vowed to the Hartford Courant that he would not renew the rivalry with the Eagles.
"We won't play BC after they leave here," Calhoun said at the time. "I have no desire to play Boston College. Not for the fact that they are leaving but how they did it. I will not play Boston College as long as I'm here."
Lingering resentment at Boston College over harsh comments like that one from Calhoun is apparently part of the reason the Huskies don't have an invitation to the more stable ACC.
According to a story in Saturday's Boston Globe, the ACC originally targeted Syracuse and UConn for its plan to expand to 14 members last month, but it eventually dropped the Huskies in favor of Pittsburgh when Boston College expressed objections. Boston College athletic director Gene DeFilippo was surprisingly candid about the role his school played in keeping UConn out, telling the Globe, "We didn't want them in. It was a matter of turf. We wanted to be the New England team."
It's especially galling to UConn fans that Boston College had the power to keep their school out of the ACC for now because the Huskies have eclipsed the Eagles athletically recently. Whereas UConn boasts three national championships in men's basketball, seven in women's basketball and a BCS bowl berth in football last season, Boston College has none of those (though its hockey program may be the nation's best).
Expect UConn to continue to push for an invite to the ACC against Boston College's wishes because that appears to be the school's best option. In addition to the ACC promising more stability and TV revenue, Calhoun appears intrigued with the challenge of being in the same basketball conference as Duke and North Carolina.
"We should always feel indebted to the Big East, but having said that, it's time for us to move forward now," he told the Hartford Courant last month. "I've talked to [UConn President Susan Herbst] about this, and we need to do what's best for our university."
Here's one reason to hope the ACC does invite UConn someday: Watching the Huskies rekindle their suddenly fierce rivalry with Boston College would be a treat for fans in the Northeast.
http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/basket...UConn-8217?urn=ncaab-wp5260#remaining-content
When Boston College participated in Big East strategizing sessions in 2003 only to covertly depart for the ACC weeks later, UConn coach Jim Calhoun vowed to the Hartford Courant that he would not renew the rivalry with the Eagles.
"We won't play BC after they leave here," Calhoun said at the time. "I have no desire to play Boston College. Not for the fact that they are leaving but how they did it. I will not play Boston College as long as I'm here."
Lingering resentment at Boston College over harsh comments like that one from Calhoun is apparently part of the reason the Huskies don't have an invitation to the more stable ACC.
According to a story in Saturday's Boston Globe, the ACC originally targeted Syracuse and UConn for its plan to expand to 14 members last month, but it eventually dropped the Huskies in favor of Pittsburgh when Boston College expressed objections. Boston College athletic director Gene DeFilippo was surprisingly candid about the role his school played in keeping UConn out, telling the Globe, "We didn't want them in. It was a matter of turf. We wanted to be the New England team."
It's especially galling to UConn fans that Boston College had the power to keep their school out of the ACC for now because the Huskies have eclipsed the Eagles athletically recently. Whereas UConn boasts three national championships in men's basketball, seven in women's basketball and a BCS bowl berth in football last season, Boston College has none of those (though its hockey program may be the nation's best).
Expect UConn to continue to push for an invite to the ACC against Boston College's wishes because that appears to be the school's best option. In addition to the ACC promising more stability and TV revenue, Calhoun appears intrigued with the challenge of being in the same basketball conference as Duke and North Carolina.
"We should always feel indebted to the Big East, but having said that, it's time for us to move forward now," he told the Hartford Courant last month. "I've talked to [UConn President Susan Herbst] about this, and we need to do what's best for our university."
Here's one reason to hope the ACC does invite UConn someday: Watching the Huskies rekindle their suddenly fierce rivalry with Boston College would be a treat for fans in the Northeast.
http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/basket...UConn-8217?urn=ncaab-wp5260#remaining-content
bearcat jeff
Hoops Moderator
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2010
- Messages
- 7,502
Big East ready to go after Boise State?
The Big East is apparently ready to make one final push to keep its embattled football league together. With the defections of Syracuse and Pittsburgh to the Atlantic Coast Conference, with TCU, who had been scheduled to join the league next season as a full member moving to the Big 12,and with Louisville apparently ready to join the Horned Frogs in moving to the Big 12, the Big East options seemed limited.
But that may change. According to sources in the Big East, the conference is looking at a plan which will invite Navy, Air Force and Boise State into the league as members in football only as well as Temple and Central Florida as members in all sports. The possibility of adding Villanova as the 12th team in football is also being discussed.
If Louisville chooses to stay in the Big East, the league would have 12 football members and could begin a conference championship game which would increase the value of any television contract the conference would receive.
Boise State, which has become a perennial Top 5 team in the past several years is the key element. If the Broncos, who would explore the possibility of joining another conference such as the Missouri Valley Conference or the Western Athletic Conference in all other sports, came to the Big East, they would also bring much needed BCS points which are necessary for the Big East to maintain its status as a BCS bowl.
The key to this for the Big East is Boise, which could bring significant television dollars in a new contract as well as BCS points and the prestige of a team which could compete for the national championship.
The key for Boise and for Air Force would be to find a place for the other sports besides football. One place could very well be the Western Athletic Conference. "We've had discussions with Air Force about joining in all sports but football,'' said WAC commissioner Karl Benson this afternoon. "And we would certainly be willing to talk to Boise State about the same arrangement.
A source in the Big East told the Newark-Star Ledger that the inclusion of Boise "had been discussed.''
If the Big East could secure Boise State, Air Force and Navy in football only and add Temple and UCF it would be set in football and probably have a better league than now exists with more of a national footprint.
In basketball, the inclusion of Temple and UCF would put the Big East back to 16 teams. Temple would also elevate the Big East basketball profile which was damaged by the departure of Syracuse and Pittsburgh.
http://articles.boston.com/2011-10-09/sports/30260803_1_boise-state-big-east-football-members
The Big East is apparently ready to make one final push to keep its embattled football league together. With the defections of Syracuse and Pittsburgh to the Atlantic Coast Conference, with TCU, who had been scheduled to join the league next season as a full member moving to the Big 12,and with Louisville apparently ready to join the Horned Frogs in moving to the Big 12, the Big East options seemed limited.
But that may change. According to sources in the Big East, the conference is looking at a plan which will invite Navy, Air Force and Boise State into the league as members in football only as well as Temple and Central Florida as members in all sports. The possibility of adding Villanova as the 12th team in football is also being discussed.
If Louisville chooses to stay in the Big East, the league would have 12 football members and could begin a conference championship game which would increase the value of any television contract the conference would receive.
Boise State, which has become a perennial Top 5 team in the past several years is the key element. If the Broncos, who would explore the possibility of joining another conference such as the Missouri Valley Conference or the Western Athletic Conference in all other sports, came to the Big East, they would also bring much needed BCS points which are necessary for the Big East to maintain its status as a BCS bowl.
The key to this for the Big East is Boise, which could bring significant television dollars in a new contract as well as BCS points and the prestige of a team which could compete for the national championship.
The key for Boise and for Air Force would be to find a place for the other sports besides football. One place could very well be the Western Athletic Conference. "We've had discussions with Air Force about joining in all sports but football,'' said WAC commissioner Karl Benson this afternoon. "And we would certainly be willing to talk to Boise State about the same arrangement.
A source in the Big East told the Newark-Star Ledger that the inclusion of Boise "had been discussed.''
If the Big East could secure Boise State, Air Force and Navy in football only and add Temple and UCF it would be set in football and probably have a better league than now exists with more of a national footprint.
In basketball, the inclusion of Temple and UCF would put the Big East back to 16 teams. Temple would also elevate the Big East basketball profile which was damaged by the departure of Syracuse and Pittsburgh.
http://articles.boston.com/2011-10-09/sports/30260803_1_boise-state-big-east-football-members
bearcat jeff
Hoops Moderator
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2010
- Messages
- 7,502
Mark Kiszla: Air Force preparing to leave Mountain West for Big East
SOUTH BEND, Ind. — Get ready to kiss Air Force goodbye. The Mountain West Conference is on the verge of losing a charter member.
The Falcons are looking to fly far away to save the Big East from disintegration, with the hope that fellow military academies Navy and Army will join them in the league.
"Our interest is high in the Big East. That's fair to say," Air Force athletic director Hans Mueh told me Saturday.
"This stuff is moving fast."
He expects that the future of Air Force athletics will be decided by the end of October. The plan would have the Falcons joining the Big East only in football, while moving teams in other sports to the Missouri Valley Conference.
"In my perfect world, with the Big East on the radar, I would love Air Force, Navy and Army to be in that conference together," said Mueh, stressing that no final decision has been made.
But after talking with Mueh extensively outside a somber locker room in the wake of the Falcons' 59-33 loss to Notre Dame, it clearly sounded as if Air Force is gazing squarely at the exit door from the Mountain West, a conference it played a key role establishing in 1999.
"I could just sit back and wait, but that's not in the best interest of my cadets. I need money to allow them to compete," Mueh said. "For us, competition is a mission. It builds the leadership, self-confidence, discipline, teamwork, courage and stamina that we want in the officers we're producing for America."
Know what the biggest shocker in Air Force's decision might be?
Given an opportunity to join Oklahoma and Texas in a revamped Big 12, the Falcons have said thanks, but no thanks.
"We were approached by the Big 12, and I told them we're not a good fit for that conference. In the Big 12, geography makes sense, the economics make sense, but recruiting makes no sense for us. I can't recruit against Texas, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State," Mueh said.
"That's why I turned down the Big 12. I can't do that to my kids, because they'll get beat up. I'd love the extra $12 million or whatever it would be per year from the TV money. And I know how I'd spend the money. I'd build a new soccer stadium, and I'd build a new baseball facility, all in one year. But I can't do that."
Loyalty is dead in college football, and television contracts for football have gone insane. Greed rules.
"There are terrible, terrible hard feelings in college athletics," Mueh said. "I'm so disappointed with my fellow athletic directors. I think we have put the student-athlete in second place while chasing the dollar."
Here's the real bottom line for Air Force: It is better to break the hearts of old friends on the field before they dump you.
Leaving the Mountain West would put traditional rivalries with Colorado State and Wyoming in jeopardy for the Falcons.
"The first thing I'll do is go to them and ask forgiveness for leaving the Mountain West, if that's what happens," Mueh said. "Then I'll ask them if they'd like to continue playing a traditional rival in football. I can't imagine they would say no. It's a big game for both Colorado State and Wyoming."
Air Force and Navy have negotiated extensively to ensure they move together to the Big East, and gone so far as to lobby Army to join them as football partners in the league.
Mueh insisted: "The Big East wants Army. Absolutely." The Black Knights, however, have concerns their program might not be ready for the rigors of playing West Virginia and other top teams in the Big East on a regular basis.
Despite the recent defections of Pittsburgh and Syracuse to the Atlantic Coast Conference, it appears the reports of the Big East's imminent death might have been exaggerated. Mueh believes the league will soon have 10 football-playing members. He also termed any uncertainty in the league's automatic qualifying status for the BCS as not a deal-breaker for the Falcons.
"The conference holding together and assuring us stability, that's what is huge," said Mueh, who anticipates Big East leadership will make a recommitment to solidarity this week.
Amid all the money-grubbing and broken relationships on the scarred college athletic landscape, we must ask: Can the Mountain West survive?
"It will survive," Mueh predicted.
But Air Force will do what's right for Air Force, even if it means turning its back on old friends.
http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_19073868
SOUTH BEND, Ind. — Get ready to kiss Air Force goodbye. The Mountain West Conference is on the verge of losing a charter member.
The Falcons are looking to fly far away to save the Big East from disintegration, with the hope that fellow military academies Navy and Army will join them in the league.
"Our interest is high in the Big East. That's fair to say," Air Force athletic director Hans Mueh told me Saturday.
"This stuff is moving fast."
He expects that the future of Air Force athletics will be decided by the end of October. The plan would have the Falcons joining the Big East only in football, while moving teams in other sports to the Missouri Valley Conference.
"In my perfect world, with the Big East on the radar, I would love Air Force, Navy and Army to be in that conference together," said Mueh, stressing that no final decision has been made.
But after talking with Mueh extensively outside a somber locker room in the wake of the Falcons' 59-33 loss to Notre Dame, it clearly sounded as if Air Force is gazing squarely at the exit door from the Mountain West, a conference it played a key role establishing in 1999.
"I could just sit back and wait, but that's not in the best interest of my cadets. I need money to allow them to compete," Mueh said. "For us, competition is a mission. It builds the leadership, self-confidence, discipline, teamwork, courage and stamina that we want in the officers we're producing for America."
Know what the biggest shocker in Air Force's decision might be?
Given an opportunity to join Oklahoma and Texas in a revamped Big 12, the Falcons have said thanks, but no thanks.
"We were approached by the Big 12, and I told them we're not a good fit for that conference. In the Big 12, geography makes sense, the economics make sense, but recruiting makes no sense for us. I can't recruit against Texas, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State," Mueh said.
"That's why I turned down the Big 12. I can't do that to my kids, because they'll get beat up. I'd love the extra $12 million or whatever it would be per year from the TV money. And I know how I'd spend the money. I'd build a new soccer stadium, and I'd build a new baseball facility, all in one year. But I can't do that."
Loyalty is dead in college football, and television contracts for football have gone insane. Greed rules.
"There are terrible, terrible hard feelings in college athletics," Mueh said. "I'm so disappointed with my fellow athletic directors. I think we have put the student-athlete in second place while chasing the dollar."
Here's the real bottom line for Air Force: It is better to break the hearts of old friends on the field before they dump you.
Leaving the Mountain West would put traditional rivalries with Colorado State and Wyoming in jeopardy for the Falcons.
"The first thing I'll do is go to them and ask forgiveness for leaving the Mountain West, if that's what happens," Mueh said. "Then I'll ask them if they'd like to continue playing a traditional rival in football. I can't imagine they would say no. It's a big game for both Colorado State and Wyoming."
Air Force and Navy have negotiated extensively to ensure they move together to the Big East, and gone so far as to lobby Army to join them as football partners in the league.
Mueh insisted: "The Big East wants Army. Absolutely." The Black Knights, however, have concerns their program might not be ready for the rigors of playing West Virginia and other top teams in the Big East on a regular basis.
Despite the recent defections of Pittsburgh and Syracuse to the Atlantic Coast Conference, it appears the reports of the Big East's imminent death might have been exaggerated. Mueh believes the league will soon have 10 football-playing members. He also termed any uncertainty in the league's automatic qualifying status for the BCS as not a deal-breaker for the Falcons.
"The conference holding together and assuring us stability, that's what is huge," said Mueh, who anticipates Big East leadership will make a recommitment to solidarity this week.
Amid all the money-grubbing and broken relationships on the scarred college athletic landscape, we must ask: Can the Mountain West survive?
"It will survive," Mueh predicted.
But Air Force will do what's right for Air Force, even if it means turning its back on old friends.
http://www.denverpost.com/sports/ci_19073868
JasonS
Football Moderator
Thanks for posting the articles Jeff! The last two you posted is about the only scenerio I can see for keeping the Big East a viable BCS AQ conference. Considering nobody seemed to ever want Boise, it is kind of ironic that they are potentially this important to a BCS conference. It makes sense for Boise too. I don't see the Big 12 or Pac 12 ever coming to them with an offer.
Edit: AF makes a lot of sense too. They have been solid in football for sure. Plus, it would be fun to road trip out there too!
Edit: AF makes a lot of sense too. They have been solid in football for sure. Plus, it would be fun to road trip out there too!
UC football went to the equivalent of the Final 4 when they played in the 2009 Orange Bowl and the 2010 Sugar Bowl. UC basketball has not been to a Final 4 in 20 years. Also UC/Conference received $20 million for each BCS game while each participant/conference receives $2 million for playing in the Final 4. That makes Football 10 times more relevant then basketball.
JasonS
Football Moderator
Ralph, please go read post #142. Thanks.
TheLivingLegend
Well-known member
The last 5 years? Cmon. UC was probably a water polo school over basketball because of the dark era. Switching the title over 5 years is absurd.
The Big East is made up of basketball schools, thats just a fact. Ill say its a even title when UC plays in a better football conference. If they go the Big12 route (which doenst seem realistic because they wont be invited) and continually win like they have in the BE ill give it to ya.
UC football aint the GCL, its a solid GMC conference. Get to the big time and we will talk.
Jason : For me, reports come out every single day about "whats new". It is what it is. Reading all the reports, following them will just make your head spin. I choose to wait and see how things play out, once a decision is final ill be more apt to staying on topic. my apologies.
Last edited:
TheLivingLegend
Well-known member
Using two bowl games in which UC lost is pathetic.
JasonS
Football Moderator
Still talking about this pointless argument is pathetic too.
TheLivingLegend
Well-known member
Its a much better debate then watching a ticker run on ESPN stating. "Big12 to expand"... "Big12 to add teams"... "Big12 decides to not expand"... "BigEast looking for teams"... "BigEast considers new prospects"... "BigEast considers a new school"..."Big12 not interested in expanding" blah blah blaahhh.
Living in a far gone basketball past is worse than pathetic.
TheLivingLegend
Well-known member
Being Ralphy is pathetic.
TheLivingLegend
Well-known member
Ya because the B12 wont invite UC to join.
Kingsley Court
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 2, 2010
- Messages
- 1,252
Ralph already claimed they got it and turned it down, well because he hadn't seen a report that said otherwise.
DontMissHim
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 2, 2010
- Messages
- 807
Uh, no they didn't. No such thing. Also, just going to the BCS games doesn't make a team money. You know Uconn lost money by going to their BCS game last year, don't you? I wonder if they lost money going to the NC game. Since you think Football is 10 times more relevant, they must have lost a shit load of money.