Crosstown shootout

[more cowbell]

I'm a fan of both schools, but recruits don't care about championships from the 1960s, they care about making it to the NBA, winning in the tournament and playing in front of sellouts. UC fans need to put their faith in Mick, donate money and start going to the games. It is in both schools best interest for each school to be competitive.

 

[Thegreatone]

Is it better to be relevant now or to be relevant 50 years ago?

If your claim to fame is 2 tournament titles in 1961 and 1962 (a year before a tough Loyola team won it and three years before UTEP did) are you really a successful basketball program?

Maybe Mick will turn things around, but you have been to 2 sweet 16s in the last 15 years. I am a UC fan, but i get tired of hearing about the NCAA championships.

Is it better to have been relevent before or never been relevant at all?

Who cares about sweet 16's honestly. Elite 8 are impressive but no one is pounding their chest about Elite 8's.

In my lifetime UC has:

3 elite 8's
1 Final Four
2 AP #1 rankings
1 Player of the Year
1 Coach of the Year
1 Top overall draft pick

That aint too shabby.

X was more consistent during Miller but a lot of that has to do with UC having to start from scratch.

UC has had better seasons the last 2 years IMO. Would you agree?

 

[rallie25]

Why is a X fan on the UC site anyway? Does X have their on blog site?

 

[more cowbell]

better seasons than Xavier? I would say they are about equal the last two years. Definitely on an uptick. It will be interesting to see how UC progresses with the dearth of highly ranked recruits that Mick is bringing in.

 

[more cowbell]

Why is a X fan on the UC site anyway? Does X have their on blog site?

Don't you appreciate banter more than just hearing Ralph say that UC will win the tournament next year?

 

[adrock]

Why is a X fan on the UC site anyway? Does X have their on blog site?

Don't you appreciate banter more than just hearing Ralph say that UC will win the tournament next year?

X fans, UofL fans, WVU fans, and fans of all other teams are welcome here. As long as they act like civil adults.

 

[Scheids21]

X fans, UofL fans, WVU fans, and fans of all other teams are welcome here. As long as they act like civil adults.

WVU fans don't know how to use the internet

 

[adrock]

WVU fans don't know how to use the internet

Well played

 

[Thegreatone]

better seasons than Xavier? I would say they are about equal the last two years. Definitely on an uptick. It will be interesting to see how UC progresses with the dearth of highly ranked recruits that Mick is bringing in.

I am not saying UC is winning titles and X is in CBI but I think it is fair to say one would have to have had a better season. I will use their seed in the tourny, how far they got in tourny, head to head, and top 50 wins.

2011:

Cincy: 6 seed Xavier: 6 seed Advantage: EVEN
Cincy: 2nd round Xavier: 1st round Advantage: CINCY
Cincy :beat X by 20 Xavier: lost to Cincy by 20 Advantage:CINCY
Cincy: had 7 Top 50 wins Xavier: had 3 top 50 wins Advantage: CINCY

Advantage?

Cincy

2012:

Cincy: 6 seed Xavier: 11 seed Advantage: CINCY
Cincy: Sweet 16 Xavier: Sweet 16 Advantage: EVEN
Cincy: lost to X by 23 Xavier: beat Cincy by 23 Advantage: Xavier
Cincy: had 8 top 50 wins Xavier: had 5 top 50 wins Advantage: Cincy

Advantage?

Cincy

Looking deeper into this year and it is not even close. Looking at the tourny Cincy played much better competition. They made it to Saturday night of the beast tourny. Xaviers best win was probably Cincinnati but for arguement sake I will say @ Vandy without their top player in OT.

Cincy had wins of Gtown 2x, Louisville, Syracuse, and Marquette which most would argue is better than @ Vandy.

So I would argue that 2 out of Chris Macks 3 years have not matched Cincy's success on the court so I disagree when Cowbell says X has recent success.

Cowbell would you disagree with these numbers?

 

[more cowbell]

I would say things may slant a little more in UC's favor. It's impossible to compare conference schedules as undoubtedly the Big East is better than the A10 (even if the big east is a bit overrated).

UC made it a round further in the tournament in 2011 and they both made the sweet 16 in 2012. UC beat X by 20 and X beat UC by 23. Xavier had a higher rpi in both seasons. I would say both schools did pretty well, but I would give UC a slight edge due to tournament performance.

 

[Thegreatone]

I would say things may slant a little more in UC's favor. It's impossible to compare conference schedules as undoubtedly the Big East is better than the A10 (even if the big east is a bit overrated).

UC made it a round further in the tournament in 2011 and they both made the sweet 16 in 2012. UC beat X by 20 and X beat UC by 23. Xavier had a higher rpi in both seasons. I would say both schools did pretty well, but I would give UC a slight edge due to tournament performance.

No they didnt

http://www.teamrankings.com/ncb/rpi/

 

[Thegreatone]

I'm a fan of both schools, but recruits don't care about championships from the 1960s, they care about making it to the NBA, winning in the tournament and playing in front of sellouts. UC fans need to put their faith in Mick, donate money and start going to the games. It is in both schools best interest for each school to be competitive.

You are clearly a fan of Xavier. No issue with that. I have encouraged a lot of the Xavier fans to post here.

 

[more cowbell]

No they didnt

http://www.teamrankings.com/ncb/rpi/

You know well enough that RPI varies by site.

http://insider.espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/rpi

Since I did not grow up in Cincinnati, I don't feel the animosity that a lot of X fans feel towards UC. I genuinely root for UC as long as they aren't playing X. The only team I root against is Dayton. I love watching their failure.

 

[Thegreatone]

You know well enough that RPI varies by site.

http://insider.espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/rpi

Since I did not grow up in Cincinnati, I don't feel the animosity that a lot of X fans feel towards UC. I genuinely root for UC as long as they aren't playing X. The only team I root against is Dayton. I love watching their failure.

There is nothing that screams Xavier fan like talking about how much you hate Dayton.

No UC fans care about Dayton.

 

[Kingsley Court]

There is nothing that screams Xavier fan like talking about how much you hate Dayton.

No UC fans care about Dayton.

True, but Dayton is Xavier's biggest rival. Cowbell is clearly a Xavier fan.

Also, to answer your question, it depends on how you define success. Is it how far you got in the post season, is it how good your regular season was, a mixture of both?

I think Xavier had a better regular season two years ago, but UC did better in the post season, I think UC had a better regular season this year, and both teams got to the sweet 16.

 

[Kingsley Court]

2012:

Cincy: 6 seed Xavier: 11 seed Advantage: CINCY
Cincy: Sweet 16 Xavier: Sweet 16 Advantage: EVEN
Cincy: lost to X by 23 Xavier: beat Cincy by 23 Advantage: Xavier
Cincy: had 8 top 50 wins Xavier: had 5 top 50 wins Advantage: Cincy

So I would argue that 2 out of Chris Macks 3 years have not matched Cincy's success on the court so I disagree when Cowbell says X has recent success.

Cowbell would you disagree with these numbers?

Interesting numbers for last year. Do you have to include the fact that UC had far more chances to beat top 50 teams than Xavier? I'm not sure how many chances each team got, but say UC got 12 chances and Xavier had 7, who would be more impressive.

Also, I would argue that during his time at Xavier, Chris Mack has had better success than Cronin. Two sweet 16's and a first round loss. VS 1 sweet 16, 1 first round win, and not making the tournament. Thus, recent success would go to Xavier.

Also, Xavier was more competitive in each of the sweet 16 games than UC was. Not that it makes much of a difference, because they were both losses, just think losing in double OT and then by 5(I think it was) is better than losing by 15.

 

[TheShoeFits]

Interesting numbers for last year. Do you have to include the fact that UC had far more chances to beat top 50 teams than Xavier? I'm not sure how many chances each team got, but say UC got 12 chances and Xavier had 7, who would be more impressive.

Also, I would argue that during his time at Xavier, Chris Mack has had better success than Cronin. Two sweet 16's and a first round loss. VS 1 sweet 16, 1 first round win, and not making the tournament. Thus, recent success would go to Xavier.

Also, Xavier was more competitive in each of the sweet 16 games than UC was. Not that it makes much of a difference, because they were both losses, just think losing in double OT and then by 5(I think it was) is better than losing by 15.

Keep in mind that Xavier played and LOST by five to the 3 seed in the Sweet 16. Cincy played and BEAT the 3 seed in the Round of 32.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

I'm a huge UC fan. That said, there is only one way to compare these two schools and that is head to head. X beat the snot out of us this year. I hope we return the favor next year. Right now they are king of the city.

 

[Thegreatone]

Interesting numbers for last year. Do you have to include the fact that UC had far more chances to beat top 50 teams than Xavier? I'm not sure how many chances each team got, but say UC got 12 chances and Xavier had 7, who would be more impressive.

Also, I would argue that during his time at Xavier, Chris Mack has had better success than Cronin. Two sweet 16's and a first round loss. VS 1 sweet 16, 1 first round win, and not making the tournament. Thus, recent success would go to Xavier.

Also, Xavier was more competitive in each of the sweet 16 games than UC was. Not that it makes much of a difference, because they were both losses, just think losing in double OT and then by 5(I think it was) is better than losing by 15.

UC won 7 games in 12 chances verse RPI top 50.

More impressively, they won 5 out of 7 chances verse RPI top 25 with ALL 5 wins verse the RPI top 15.


By contrast, Xavier won 4 out of 10 chances verse RPI top 50 with only 1 win in four chances verse the top 25. No wins in the top 15.

It isnt even debatable.


In 2011 you say Xavier had a better regular season.

X went 3 top 50 wins out of 8 chances with 0 top 25 wins.

Cincy went 7 out of 16 wins verse top 50 (better % then X) with 4 wins over the top 25.

How any of this equates to Xavier being better than UC in either year. in regular season or post season I dont understand.

Plus, my arguement was not that Mick has been more successful in their full tenures but rather Mick has been more successful than Mack in the same timeframe of the past 3 years.

 

[TheLongHaul]

Interesting numbers for last year. Do you have to include the fact that UC had far more chances to beat top 50 teams than Xavier? I'm not sure how many chances each team got, but say UC got 12 chances and Xavier had 7, who would be more impressive.

so you are saying UC had a tougher schedule? I agree.

I'm a huge UC fan. That said, there is only one way to compare these two schools and that is head to head. X beat the snot out of us this year. I hope we return the favor next year. Right now they are king of the city.

And Presbyterian is ahead of UC?

XU started off wayyyy better than UC which included the butt whipping in Evanston. But UC finished the season better and if I recall, ended up ranked higher in final polls. XU got to the sweet 16 by beating a ND team who had been struggling and sucks on the road, and by beating a crappy 15 seed. Most XU fans were concerned of them getting into the tournament yet somehow beating those two teams totally redeemed their season?