Norfolk State

[jacobkdoyle]

Game is Tuesday at 7 PM on ESPNU.

They are 4-5. Wins against Columbia Union College (78-58), Northern Arizona (70-66), Mercy College (71-65), and Coppin State (88-56). Losses against South Carolina (84-69), Indiana State (70-61), Ohio (93-71), DePaul (82-78), and Northern Kentucky (81-60).

They are ranked #245 in KenPom.

Norfolk State 58
UC 68

 

[L-T]

Game is Tuesday at 7 PM on ESPNU.

They are 4-5. Wins against Columbia Union College (78-58), Northern Arizona (70-66), Mercy College (71-65), and Coppin State (88-56). Losses against South Carolina (84-69), Indiana State (70-61), Ohio (93-71), DePaul (82-78), and Northern Kentucky (81-60).

They are ranked #245 in KenPom.

Norfolk State 58
UC 68

Mercy College scored 65 against them, NKU 81, Depaul 82, Ohio U. 93, and you only have us scoring 68? Wow, you have really lost faith in our new offense.

 

[jds513]

95-52. We are good at beating down the cruddy teams

 

[jacobkdoyle]

Mercy College scored 65 against them, NKU 81, Depaul 82, Ohio U. 93, and you only have us scoring 68? Wow, you have really lost faith in our new offense.

I haven't lost faith in it, but I'm afraid our coach has. Hope I'm wrong. Although if I am, it really won't be proven until the VCU and Iowa State games.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

I haven't lost faith in it, but I'm afraid our coach has. Hope I'm wrong. Although if I am, it really won't be proven until the VCU and Iowa State games.

what I hope is the team continues to develope the new approach. Switching back to our old style now will only set us back farther. What everyone saw in the X game was total confusion by the players. The best thing about college basketball is the rosters changes every year. Mick will be able to recruit players to his brand of basketball. My hope is we make the dance,the team finds comfort in the new style and we land a couple of more players that fit our new style. This years and next years team will be defined by how much improvement the players make in perfecting our new approach. If it's a change of identity we are after go all in Mick. Quit dicking around with it. You'll only confuse the team. I think Mick knows this and it's been reflective in his comments. Your ten years in. Playing defense and building your brand was fine for awhile. We are regulars in the dance and recruiting has picked up somewhat. But if it is a upper tier program your after you need to be all in now. To continually recruit the kind of kids needed to play that style of basketball you need to put the ball in the hoop. Other wise we will always be a hard working blue collar type that never wins the NCAA. You have a nice little program here, you make the tourney every year and your kids graduate. Your job is probably safe for years to come. But if you want to win a championship you need to take some chances. Be the best Mick or move on.

 

[Cin City]

We will be fine. I'm confident in that and it's what I am buying into believing. These guys have been tested and found ways to win. Last year they played as underdogs and sometimes reversing that role and mentality takes some time. I get that it is frustrating as hell as a fan. But we are still 8-2 with some good opportunities moving forward. These guy know how to win (@SMU, SDST, Purdue). A team is like a hand, all five fingers need to be in sync or its going to be pretty messed up. (If any of you are missing a hand I apologize for the analogy and mean no ill wills. I'm running low on comparisons this am....guess I could have said a clock.)

 

[insomniaisevil]

I was at the NKU game vs. Norfolk State last night. I'm an NKU grad (and also lifetime Bearcats fan), so I've watched the Norse play enough to know what they have (a very well coached defense, a couple VERY good 3 point shooters and one very solid post presence) and what they don't (size, depth, top level talent).

We'll just say this, Clark, Ellis and DeBerry could all have 20 each against Norfolk State, if the offense plays smart. Norfolk State has no size. No ability to stop the post at all.

NKU does have one very good post player (Jalen Billups) and once they started running the offense through him in the 2nd half last night, they basically buried Norfolk State. As much as I love the Norse as well, they aren't exactly a powerhouse team this season.

If the Bearcats play hard on defense and smart on offense, they can win this game by 30 or 40 points...easily.

The more the Bearcat bigs touch the ball in the game, the bigger the margin of victory is going to be.

 

[L-T]

We have struggled to beat the last 2 cupcakes. Whatever mojo we had 2-3 weeks ago is now gone. 3 weeks ago, I would have probably called this a 105-51 victory. Today, I have no idea. I'll just guess 91-61.

 

[Bearcat_NTS]

I haven't lost faith in it, but I'm afraid our coach has. Hope I'm wrong. Although if I am, it really won't be proven until the VCU and Iowa State games.

Jacob, take a deep breath my friend. It is a long season. I'm concerned about Mick too but not THAT much.

 

[kskenyon4]

84-64 Bearcats

 

[jacobkdoyle]

Jacob, take a deep breath my friend. It is a long season. I'm concerned about Mick too but not THAT much.

It's his "big game" approach that scares me. Starting to remind me of Marvin Lewis and the Bengals. Right when they have you fooled into thinking they can turn the corner, they come out and play tight and scared against the good competition.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

what I hope is the team continues to develope the new approach. Switching back to our old style now will only set us back farther. What everyone saw in the X game was total confusion by the players. The best thing about college basketball is the rosters changes every year. Mick will be able to recruit players to his brand of basketball. My hope is we make the dance,the team finds comfort in the new style and we land a couple of more players that fit our new style. This years and next years team will be defined by how much improvement the players make in perfecting our new approach. If it's a change of identity we are after go all in Mick. Quit dicking around with it. You'll only confuse the team. I think Mick knows this and it's been reflective in his comments. Your ten years in. Playing defense and building your brand was fine for awhile. We are regulars in the dance and recruiting has picked up somewhat. But if it is a upper tier program your after you need to be all in now. To continually recruit the kind of kids needed to play that style of basketball you need to put the ball in the hoop. Other wise we will always be a hard working blue collar type that never wins the NCAA. You have a nice little program here, you make the tourney every year and your kids graduate. Your job is probably safe for years to come. But if you want to win a championship you need to take some chances. Be the best Mick or move on.

I agree. He needs to trust the process. He can blame the "geniuses" all he wants, but he is the one who ultimately made the decision to tweak our MO. And the big games are no time to get cold feet.

 

[Bearcat_NTS]

It's his "big game" approach that scares me. Starting to remind me of Marvin Lewis and the Bengals. Right when they have you fooled into thinking they can turn the corner, they come out and play tight and scared against the good competition.

They swept SMU last year. Manned up and gave Kentucky a hell of a game too. Remember just a few years ago we had 8 wins over ranked teams. Mick does well in big games just not against Xavier.

 

[UCBearcats]

UC - 89 // Norfolk - 62

-- Mick will complain in the post game about toughness and our guys not taking them seriously enough.....that will be the catalyst for us to play a low scoring, ugly basketball game against VCU

 

[jacobkdoyle]

They swept SMU last year. Manned up and gave Kentucky a hell of a game too. Remember just a few years ago we had 8 wins over ranked teams. Mick does well in big games just not against Xavier.

I'm speaking more to the way we go about it. Mick has grinded out wins in the past by making the game as gross as possible. We weren't supposed to be doing that this year. And the fact that we have a few times now makes me think it is bc he panics and doesn't really believe in a different approach. But that ship has sailed. We all already got a glimpse of a different looking Bearcat team and I for one don't want to go back. If he chooses to take us right back to the majority of the last 9 years, he going to be dealing with a pissed off fan base all year long. Reverting back worked to grind out Nebraska and GW. 2 teams that probably won't make the tournament (GW might). But after reverting back to it cost us a loss, some are already questioning whether he's the right guy to get us to the next level. And for those saying Xavier was just the better team...how do you know? We didn't get a chance to find out. We were so busy setting the game back to dinosaur times, we didn't actually let our guys try to make plays. It's funny how we lost and are so wrapped up in the mistakes. I suspect that's bc they came from being tentative (a symptom of the rock fight approach). But Xavier made a ton of mistakes and out of control plays. But they're allowed to bc their coach trusts them. He believes the good and great plays will outweigh the bad. Mecura is a good example. That guy would ride the pine for Mick, but under Mack he's the ballsy hustle guy who doesn't freak out and look to the bench after each mistake bc an angry coach is screaming and breathing down his neck every step of the way. And wouldn't you know it, he makes a huge strip play on Clark when we get our one and only run out, and forces an offensive foul on another play as well. His teammates rally around it. I don't feel like our players have the permission to play loose like that when Mick gets spooked by a good team bc he demands a structure that doesn't allow for a single mistake by anyone, ever. But the funny thing is, when you're dealing with 18-22 year olds, that leads to lots of nervous mistakes. Just ask KJ.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

I wonder if we'll go with the same starters.

Jenifer and Moore should both play 15+ minutes in this game. There has to be some consequence for Clark scoring 0 points on 0-2 FG in 29 minutes, right? That can never happen again in his entire career. Maybe coming off the bench would be a wake up call. Shaq and Evans can handle the 3 and 4 against Norfolk State. Or start DeBerry at the 5 and Ellis at the 4.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

-22

 

[Bearcatboy]

I'm speaking more to the way we go about it. Mick has grinded out wins in the past by making the game as gross as possible. We weren't supposed to be doing that this year. And the fact that we have a few times now makes me think it is bc he panics and doesn't really believe in a different approach. But that ship has sailed. We all already got a glimpse of a different looking Bearcat team and I for one don't want to go back. If he chooses to take us right back to the majority of the last 9 years, he going to be dealing with a pissed off fan base all year long. Reverting back worked to grind out Nebraska and GW. 2 teams that probably won't make the tournament (GW might). But after reverting back to it cost us a loss, some are already questioning whether he's the right guy to get us to the next level. And for those saying Xavier was just the better team...how do you know? We didn't get a chance to find out. We were so busy setting the game back to dinosaur times, we didn't actually let our guys try to make plays. It's funny how we lost and are so wrapped up in the mistakes. I suspect that's bc they came from being tentative (a symptom of the rock fight approach). But Xavier made a ton of mistakes and out of control plays. But they're allowed to bc their coach trusts them. He believes the good and great plays will outweigh the bad. Mecura is a good example. That guy would ride the pine for Mick, but under Mack he's the ballsy hustle guy who doesn't freak out and look to the bench after each mistake bc an angry coach is screaming and breathing down his neck every step of the way. And wouldn't you know it, he makes a huge strip play on Clark when we get our one and only run out, and forces an offensive foul on another play as well. His teammates rally around it. I don't feel like our players have the permission to play loose like that when Mick gets spooked by a good team bc he demands a structure that doesn't allow for a single mistake by anyone, ever. But the funny thing is, when you're dealing with 18-22 year olds, that leads to lots of nervous mistakes. Just ask KJ.

I told you a month ago that we would start playing slow down grind it out basketball, every year we hear how we're going to speeded up on fastbreaks and on offense and it never ends up happening. UC basketball is slow down grind it out basketball defense first offense will come, good teams do not let you play how you want to play they take away your advantages, this year our advantage was run run run teams are taking that away and making us grind out games.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

I told you a month ago that we would start playing slow down grind it out basketball, every year we hear how we're going to speeded up on fastbreaks and on offense and it never ends up happening. UC basketball is slow down grind it out basketball defense first offense will come, good teams do not let you play how you want to play they take away your advantages, this year our advantage was run run run teams are taking that away and making us grind out games.

Yep. You're right. I'm a fool for believing it'd be different. The one thing I'd say though is that no one can take pushing the pace away from you. They can limit fast break points, but there's a difference. I just want quicker transitions from defense to offense. That doesn't mean I think we fast break all day...just a secondary break where our guys can take advantage of a breakdown a couple times per game. Like the Myles Davis example. On paper, we were technically all "back" but he saw a crease and laid it in with 26 on the shot clock. We make no attempt to get any easy baskets like that at all. Our PG is too busy standing under the basket watching the ball bounce at his feet when they aren't even pressing, waiting for someone to come back to throw it in to him. We aren't a get it out of the net and go team bc our coach doesn't want us to be. For some reason he thinks going against a set defense on every single possession is a better solution. He knows we have turnover issues, and as the stats bear out, even more so the slower we go. Those numbers even go back to last season. But he's comfortable scoring a safe 55 with "his" guys and seeing if that's good enough. It might be sometimes, but it never will be to sustain a decent tournament run. We score under what teams average to allow on the season pretty much every time we play a good team. That's a coaching and gameplan problem. I'm sure Nebraska wanted to slow a team like Villanova down too, but they still scored 87. We haven't scored over 60 one time against X in the last 5 years. Those are all years we made the tournament too. And even if X is better on D this year, in their 10 games only Alabama scored less than us. It's alarming that Mick was way more pissed after Butler than Xavier. That's so backwards.

 

[justinhub2003]

I don't get this though.

We tried this run and gun offense against Butler and we lost AT HOME. I would lose to Xavier 10x a year in Cintas If we didn't take a single loss at home.

We need a balance of grind it out on Defense and a fluid offense.

I mean, next year will be ever more primed for scoring But this year we are just 1 year removed from the grind it out offense and defense that proved so successful last season.

I mean really we added one shooter, and early on we showed we could shoot. But then look at the teams we shot well against, I thought Robert morris would be a quality win and yet I think they have one win total. We might not be as good offensively as we all thought.

We saw 4 good offensive games, Mick sees them day and night in practice and he knows what his team is working with. You can't just abandon a strategy when your sample size of showing you can change is so small.

I don't care about good tv. I personally ( i know im in the minority) want to be the best defensive team in the country. I believe that is attainable. I don't believe we have a chance to be even top 10 offensively with these guys. Maybe next year. But not now.

You can control how good your defense is, you can fight for every single possession and play with heart and be extremely successful on defense. But on offense, you can play with intensity and heart and whatever else and that doesn't mean the ball goes in the basket. Control what you can control. The answer to inconsistency on the offensive end is consistency on the other end