Xavier

[UCalum08]

After watching the final play, it reconfirms that Cobb should have drove to the hoop. When he did the shot fake he had a full 4.5 seconds and an open lane to at least the ft line. It kills me he tried to shoot the three. Just not smart bball IQ.

Also, why is it every UC/X game a X player has his career night. Dee Davis, a 26% 3-pt shooter and he goes 5-5 without touching the rim. Unreal.

 

[bearcat jeff]

I am not a XU troll (UC double alumnus) but at least for this century, we have to admit XU is simply a better basketball program than UC. They are in a better conference with more TV $$$$, recruit better basketball players (not better athletes) and they own us on the court. It's sad that it has come to this but it's hard to argue otherwise. We may be NIT bound if the ship isn't righted soon.

You can't argue the last 16 years they've owned UC head to head, but a better program overall? I won't concede that. Even when UC has been ranked #1 X finds a way to win this game. Something seems to always break their way. I give them credit. UC won nearly every statistical phase of this game and lost because a) a guy that doesn't shoot 3's well has a career night shooting b) coach doesn't adjust to said players career night fast enough c) a UC freshman makes a stupid foul/X freshman who hasn't scored all night sinks both free throws. d) UC misses a wide open look on it's last possession. Karma clearly favors X in his match up.

 

[bearcat jeff]

Guys played their guts out last night. Despite what some claim, halftime adjustments were spot-on. Xavier was en fuego again, just like last year, when we got waxed with MC roaming the sidelines. Where were the adjustments last year?

LD will take the fall for this year, but this team can't shoot deep (ranked #277 in 3P%) and lacks the experience to close-out games. MC emphasizes experience, and after reviewing the big picture emerging from the data, you can see why. If you don't have the talent, you better have experience.

It's too bad for LD, because unless he finishes strong, it's essentially the nail-in-the-coffin, in terms of him getting another decent head-coaching job.

Next year's team will improve, but the recruiting is just not good enough. I was watching a "Throwback Thursday" on the Bearcats YouTube page and the starting frontline was Kenyon Martin, Danny Fortson, and Ruben Patterson. Bottom line, the program was on a completely different level when Huggins was here.

Yeah, yeah yeah and the past 2 years he has missed the NCAA and lost in the first round of the NIT. Take that old refried crap out of here. He's gone, is never coming back. Live in the present. I believe in 2006 X had won like 7 of the last 10 shootouts so why was this even relevant?

 

[LeftyRose]

Yeah, yeah yeah and the past 2 years he has missed the NCAA and lost in the first round of the NIT. Take that old refried crap out of here. He's gone, is never coming back. Live in the present. I believe in 2006 X had won like 7 of the last 10 shootouts so why was this even relevant?

His team this year, in West Virginia mind you, is more talented than any team Cronin's assembled.

I am living in the present. In the present, I don't think Cronin can get it done.

 

[LeftyRose]

I am not a XU troll (UC double alumnus) but at least for this century, we have to admit XU is simply a better basketball program than UC. They are in a better conference with more TV $$$$, recruit better basketball players (not better athletes) and they own us on the court. It's sad that it has come to this but it's hard to argue otherwise. We may be NIT bound if the ship isn't righted soon.

I spoke with a close friend of mine who was very successful for many years coaching at the HS level. The fact that Xavier is a better program than UC at this time is not even a question. What's interesting is that we both agreed that Dayton was a better program than UC.

 

[indydoug]

Jeff I'm not so sure they aren't a better program during this century. Haven't had time to look at NCAA tourney success or top 25 finishes or other metrics as to who has better program last 15-16 years but it wouldn't surprise me if XU rates better than UC in most. I guess it depends on how you define "better program". As a former UC player, it pains me to even think it but I believe it's true given the short time frame.

 

[bearcat jeff]

His team this year, in West Virginia mind you, is more talented than any team Cronin's assembled.

I am living in the present. In the present, I don't think Cronin can get it done.

Unnecessary, irrelevant comment that is simply meant to stir things. Always easy to spot agendas. They always look backwards.

 

[indydoug]

I spoke with a close friend of mine who was very successful for many years coaching at the HS level. The fact that Xavier is a better program than UC at this time is not even a question. What's interesting is that we both agreed that Dayton was a better program than UC.

Last year's Elite 8 notwithstanding, I won't go that far!

 

[bearcat jeff]

Jeff I'm not so sure they aren't a better program during this century. Haven't had time to look at NCAA tourney success or top 25 finishes or other metrics as to who has better program last 15-16 years but it wouldn't surprise me if XU rates better than UC in most. I guess it depends on how you define "better program". As a former UC player, it pains me to even think it but I believe it's true given the short time frame.

When did you play Doug? Xavier is a good program no question. Their men's basketball program is their flagship and they treat it accordingly.

 

[LeftyRose]

Unnecessary, irrelevant comment that is simply meant to stir things. Always easy to spot agendas. They always look backwards.

I think it's relevant when he's coming into our home state and getting the talent. All of these guys rank higher than any current recruit on our roster:

Juwan Staten, Dayton (4 Star-#49 Rivals)
Devin Williams, Cincinnati (4 star-#64 Rivals)
Elijah Macon, Columbus (4 Star-#56 Rivals)
Esa Ahmad, Cleveland (4 Star-#71 Rivals)

 

[indydoug]

1978-82. Recruited by Catlett then signed when Badger was hired

 

[indydoug]

Lefty that's an impressive class.not surprising given their E8 run. Not sure they can continue to replicate that though especially when the inevitable coaching change occurs

 

[cincrulz11]

Next year's team will improve, but the recruiting is just not good enough. I was watching a "Throwback Thursday" on the Bearcats YouTube page and the starting frontline was Kenyon Martin, Danny Fortson, and Ruben Patterson. Bottom line, the program was on a completely different level when Huggins was here.

And can you believe that team was out in the 2nd round?

 

[cincrulz11]

I spoke with a close friend of mine who was very successful for many years coaching at the HS level. The fact that Xavier is a better program than UC at this time is not even a question.

Is that why xavier missed the tournament 2 years ago and basically missed it last year too?

 

[LeftyRose]

Last year's Elite 8 notwithstanding, I won't go that far!

Believe me, nothing gets my blood flowing like UC basketball but think objectively here regarding Dayton:

Better conference (A10's RPI is higher)
Less competition/more support (yes-higher attendance)
Better arena (yes-always chosen to host tourneys)
Plus they got Archie...

 

[JackBauer151]

I am not a XU troll (UC double alumnus) but at least for this century, we have to admit XU is simply a better basketball program than UC. They are in a better conference with more TV $$$$, recruit better basketball players (not better athletes) and they own us on the court. It's sad that it has come to this but it's hard to argue otherwise. We may be NIT bound if the ship isn't righted soon.

You mean the program that has missed the round of 64 two consecutive years and is on the bubble for a 3rd. Get the %#% out of here with that nonsense. They have owned us in this game over the last two decades so you can make that claim but the program comment is ridiculous. Before this year we had been ranked in the top 25 five years in a row, the top 10 the last two years, 4 straight NCAA tournament births including a sweet 16. (Dont even talk to me about their sweet 16 because they got lucky as always when Duke lost in the first round to the bonnies). We went to Big East Championship (The real Big East) while they missed the tourney being in the A-10. We did all of this with inferior facilities and a lower recruiting budget. Chris Mack should be on the hot seat. I know losing to them sucks but pull your head out of your ass and look at the big picture. The recent history all trends towards the bearcats even if we arent the big dogs we supposedly were under Huggins.

 

[indydoug]

RPI is a broken metric. Even without Louisville I still think the AAC is better than A10

 

[indydoug]

Jack, the time frame in my original post was the past 15-16 years not the last 5. The past 50-100 years no comparison. The last 15-16 ...... Look and compare the numbers. I believe XU has been to 2 Elite 8's during that time. Lucky or not it happened. I'm not trying to stir up anything, believe me I hate XU, but facts are facts. And by the way lose the personal attack about the residence of my head. Not necessary

 

[waterhead]

I don't need friends I'm here for championships. Don't tell me your best player didn't lose you game when he -7.

He didn't lose us the game.

You have no idea how to use +/- numbers


Using the +/- data from one game is borderline useless. You have to look at the overall numbers from many games and who they play with. For most of the year TC (I am guessing he still is) was top on the team in the +/-.

+/- numbers in one game won't tell you when one team or the other goes on an out of the ordinary shooting hot streak or cold streak among other things.


All this being said. Cobb has had to play with the second team most of the year (probably 75% of his minutes). Considering that his +/- numbers aren't bad overall and I would like to see him play with TC, Clark, and Ellis.

 

[bearcat jeff]

He didn't lose us the game.

You have no idea how to use +/- numbers


Using the +/- data from one game is borderline useless. You have to look at the overall numbers from many games and who they play with. For most of the year TC (I am guessing he still is) was top on the team in the +/-.

+/- numbers in one game won't tell you when one team or the other goes on an out of the ordinary shooting hot streak or cold streak among other things.


All this being said. Cobb has had to play with the second team most of the year (probably 75% of his minutes). Considering that his +/- numbers aren't bad overall and I would like to see him play with TC, Clark, and Ellis.

Those 4 should play 30 minutes.