Micks Philosophy needs to change.

[TheLongHaul]

In order to be an uptempo team you need effective ball handlers, good spacing and good passers. UC is lacking in all three. The best way for Cincinnati to win is to press and trap on defense and hope you make enough shots in the half court. If Cincinnati tried to run with Memphis or Louisville they would get blown out. UC can barely run an effective 2 on 1 break. It might benefit this team if they just minimize possessions like against Pittsburgh and hope they make enough shots.

As the skill levels increase like they will in 2014, UC may be able to play more uptempo.

Seriously? If it hasn't happened yet in Mick's tenure it isn't happening. And though I would like to see it I was the one tempering everyone's expectation of it at the beginning of the season when Mick said this would be their fastest paced team yet. I know Mick hates turnovers so much that he'll never have that type of team. I just wish he'd grasp that so he'd recruit to a half court offense/defense.

 

[L-T]

In order to be an uptempo team you need effective ball handlers, good spacing and good passers. UC is lacking in all three. The best way for Cincinnati to win is to press and trap on defense and hope you make enough shots in the half court. If Cincinnati tried to run with Memphis or Louisville they would get blown out. UC can barely run an effective 2 on 1 break. It might benefit this team if they just minimize possessions like against Pittsburgh and hope they make enough shots.

As the skill levels increase like they will in 2014, UC may be able to play more uptempo.

Just to be clear. How many more years of skill level increases will it be before Mick actually plays the type of game that he promises to play at the beginning of every single season? We were talking about these same skill level increases 5 years ago. Each year we seem to decide....ooops, guess we don't have the skill to play that style and then everyone posts that as the skill level increases, we'll play up tempo. Then a new recruiting class comes in, everyone gets all excited, Mick promises to press and run. As soon as the patsy games are done, we're back to our slow half court offense, we recruit some more guys, everyone gets all excited, recruits come in, we press and run on the patsies....and the whole process starts all over again....yada, yada, yada. Everything is always about these big promises of things to come.....that never seem to come.....but lets continue down that road anyway.

As we all know, at some point the law of averages will kick in and the stars will align and the Bearcats will advance to an elite 8 and everyone will throw it in our faces that..."See, we were right. Mick was the answer. What we'll never know is the opportunity cost of staying the course until that happens. But, in the end, who cares. We're now a football school anyway. That's where the focus seems to be. Mick provides a comfortable situation in our #2 sport, so why change?

I sincerely hope you are all right. I will enjoy eating crow for eternity if it means our basketball program gets to where we all want it to be.....at or near the top of the college basketball world.

 

[Bearcat_NTS]

Just to be clear. How many more years of skill level increases will it be before Mick actually plays the type of game that he promises to play at the beginning of every single season? We were talking about these same skill level increases 5 years ago. Each year we seem to decide....ooops, guess we don't have the skill to play that style and then everyone posts that as the skill level increases, we'll play up tempo. Then a new recruiting class comes in, everyone gets all excited, Mick promises to press and run. As soon as the patsy games are done, we're back to our slow half court offense, we recruit some more guys, everyone gets all excited, recruits come in, we press and run on the patsies....and the whole process starts all over again....yada, yada, yada. Everything is always about these big promises of things to come.....that never seem to come.....but lets continue down that road anyway.

As we all know, at some point the law of averages will kick in and the stars will align and the Bearcats will advance to an elite 8 and everyone will throw it in our faces that..."See, we were right. Mick was the answer. What we'll never know is the opportunity cost of staying the course until that happens. But, in the end, who cares. We're now a football school anyway. That's where the focus seems to be. Mick provides a comfortable situation in our #2 sport, so why change?

I sincerely hope you are all right. I will enjoy eating crow for eternity if it means our basketball program gets to where we all want it to be.....at or near the top of the college basketball world.

Cincinnati currently has the "athletes" to run an uptempo system but you also need a few good players that can handle and pass well. I think if Cash would have been healthy his last three years you may have seen a glimpse of it. I believe Caupain can rebound well enough, and pass well enough to make this happen. You also need big men that can effectively throw outlet passes, that is where I believe the increased skill level will come in handy.

 

[Robert]

I'm not buying the skill level crap anymore. There are a whole bunch of teams out here with less talent who run an efficient offense. Mick is a good coach but sometimes I think he is stubborn to the point of detriment.

 

[bearcat jeff]

It is a matter of focus. The vast majority of time is spent on defense and rebounding.

 

[bearcat jeff]

I think this season with so many new parts and people in new roles we have to watch for growth and not focus so much on the now.

 

[Bcatfollower]

I think this season with so many new parts and people in new roles we have to watch for growth and not focus so much on the now.

I agree, however ther are only three new players in the mix. The lack of experience for sanders, guyn, and shaq is another issue. Perhaps more should be done in player development/playing more minutes in cupcake or blowouts...whatever to avoid these gaps.

 

[waterhead]

Just to be clear. How many more years of skill level increases will it be before Mick actually plays the type of game that he promises to play at the beginning of every single season? We were talking about these same skill level increases 5 years ago. Each year we seem to decide....ooops, guess we don't have the skill to play that style and then everyone posts that as the skill level increases, we'll play up tempo. Then a new recruiting class comes in, everyone gets all excited, Mick promises to press and run. As soon as the patsy games are done, we're back to our slow half court offense, we recruit some more guys, everyone gets all excited, recruits come in, we press and run on the patsies....and the whole process starts all over again....yada, yada, yada. Everything is always about these big promises of things to come.....that never seem to come.....but lets continue down that road anyway.

As we all know, at some point the law of averages will kick in and the stars will align and the Bearcats will advance to an elite 8 and everyone will throw it in our faces that..."See, we were right. Mick was the answer. What we'll never know is the opportunity cost of staying the course until that happens. But, in the end, who cares. We're now a football school anyway. That's where the focus seems to be. Mick provides a comfortable situation in our #2 sport, so why change?

I sincerely hope you are all right. I will enjoy eating crow for eternity if it means our basketball program gets to where we all want it to be.....at or near the top of the college basketball world.

We know this (whether it has happened yet or not to the full extent)...Mick wants to press. Last year we had some talent and experience at guard but an injured Cash and less depth. He couldn't run. This year we have plenty of depth to run with less scoring options. If you want to press a UL or Mem...you are going to need both or you will likely be better of slowing it down.

I would still like to TRY the press against some of the better teams to see what happens though.

 

[Bearcat_NTS]

I'm not buying the skill level crap anymore. There are a whole bunch of teams out here with less talent who run an efficient offense. Mick is a good coach but sometimes I think he is stubborn to the point of detriment.

They run good stuff, it is the players running it that is the problem. Hence the skill level issue...

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Could careless what style we play as long as we win.

 

[L-T]

Could careless what style we play as long as we win.

That certainly is the "bottom line"! But, by winning, are you talking a "long" run in the NCAA tourney? Or, winning a league tourney? Or, are you talking being highly ranked and earning a high seed in the dance? Or, are you just talking a nice "winning" reguler season that leads to getting our name called on selection Sunday? Because, choices 2, 3 and 4 were not good enough for many of our fans who were happy for our coaching change. We've been one of the better defensive teams in the nation for the last three years and it hasn't translated to significant success in the NCAA tourney. I like defense as much as the next person, but you have to have at least some offense if you're going to make a run in the tournament. Again, if your winning statement applies to the 4th choice above, then I guess you're happy. If making a serious run in the NCAA is your goal, this poor offense will never get it done. We must have both!

 

[CaptDale]

That certainly is the "bottom line"! But, by winning, are you talking a "long" run in the NCAA tourney? Or, winning a league tourney? Or, are you talking being highly ranked and earning a high seed in the dance? Or, are you just talking a nice "winning" reguler season that leads to getting our name called on selection Sunday? Because, choices 2, 3 and 4 were not good enough for many of our fans who were happy for our coaching change. We've been one of the better defensive teams in the nation for the last three years and it hasn't translated to significant success in the NCAA tourney. I like defense as much as the next person, but you have to have at least some offense if you're going to make a run in the tournament. Again, if your winning statement applies to the 4th choice above, then I guess you're happy. If making a serious run in the NCAA is your goal, this poor offense will never get it done. We must have both!

I agree with you, L-T; but at this point, I think we take one game at a time with the ultimate goal to make the big dance. At that point we will have progressed as a team, grown into a cohesive unit and, hopefully become a formidable, feared opponent. We're only slightly into stage one - learning to play as a team. The D is much further along than the O. As much as I would like to look further down the road, the prudent plan of attack is to look no further than the next opponent. Conference play will just have to be the end result of our growth. NCAA selection will be predicated on how we look on paper. I like to look at the situation as a realist, not some pie-in-the-sky delusionist with, to quote Alan Greenspan, "irrational exuberance". (He probably said this when half this board was still approaching puberty). We're a decent team, and should not be embarrassed - again (See X game box score, or New Mexico). I only have one concern, and that is playing a decent team with Bigs, or even one Big. Go Cats!

 

[L-T]

I agree with you, L-T; but at this point, I think we take one game at a time with the ultimate goal to make the big dance. At that point we will have progressed as a team, grown into a cohesive unit and, hopefully become a formidable, feared opponent. We're only slightly into stage one - learning to play as a team. The D is much further along than the O. As much as I would like to look further down the road, the prudent plan of attack is to look no further than the next opponent. Conference play will just have to be the end result of our growth. NCAA selection will be predicated on how we look on paper. I like to look at the situation as a realist, not some pie-in-the-sky delusionist with, to quote Alan Greenspan, "irrational exuberance". (He probably said this when half this board was still approaching puberty). We're a decent team, and should not be embarrassed - again (See X game box score, or New Mexico). I only have one concern, and that is playing a decent team with Bigs, or even one Big. Go Cats!

I would like to be what this program has proven it can be.....plus a little more! Annually ranked in the top 20, high seeds in the NCAA Tournament, our share of league tournament championships, many highly ranked recruits, some Macdonalds All-Americans.....plus a little more. Average attendance in a bad year over 11,000, and in a good year....a sellout every game.....plus a little more! We have proven that all this is possible at the University of Cincinnati, and we should not be happy with anything less. The "little bit more" is obviously better success in the NCAA Tournament, which we all agree didn't always turn out so well.

This team "should" make the NCAA Tournament as probably an 8-12 seed, and hopefully the offense develops to the point that we surprise one or two teams. I would be shocked with anything past the 1st weekend.

 

[CaptDale]

I would like to be what this program has proven it can be.....plus a little more! Annually ranked in the top 20, high seeds in the NCAA Tournament, our share of league tournament championships, many highly ranked recruits, some Macdonalds All-Americans.....plus a little more. Average attendance in a bad year over 11,000, and in a good year....a sellout every game.....plus a little more! We have proven that all this is possible at the University of Cincinnati, and we should not be happy with anything less. The "little bit more" is obviously better success in the NCAA Tournament, which we all agree didn't always turn out so well.

This team "should" make the NCAA Tournament as probably an 8-12 seed, and hopefully the offense develops to the point that we surprise one or two teams. I would be shocked with anything past the 1st weekend.

It's all part of that seasonal progression theory. Some teams click from Day One, others progress, and still others never find it. I would like to think we're the progression team. That's up to the coaches, I guess.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

That certainly is the "bottom line"! But, by winning, are you talking a "long" run in the NCAA tourney? Or, winning a league tourney? Or, are you talking being highly ranked and earning a high seed in the dance? Or, are you just talking a nice "winning" reguler season that leads to getting our name called on selection Sunday? Because, choices 2, 3 and 4 were not good enough for many of our fans who were happy for our coaching change. We've been one of the better defensive teams in the nation for the last three years and it hasn't translated to significant success in the NCAA tourney. I like defense as much as the next person, but you have to have at least some offense if you're going to make a run in the tournament. Again, if your winning statement applies to the 4th choice above, then I guess you're happy. If making a serious run in the NCAA is your goal, this poor offense will never get it done. We must have both!

It all starts with making the Dance. Would I like the program to progress into a Duke,Ky level of success. Sure! Hopeful Mick can lead us there. He is growing and so is the Program. I've seen steady progress since the day he took over. I guess to answer your question, I'm very happy Were we are and glad we have Coach Cronin.

 

[Patrick Bateman]

That certainly is the "bottom line"! But, by winning, are you talking a "long" run in the NCAA tourney? Or, winning a league tourney? Or, are you talking being highly ranked and earning a high seed in the dance? Or, are you just talking a nice "winning" reguler season that leads to getting our name called on selection Sunday? Because, choices 2, 3 and 4 were not good enough for many of our fans who were happy for our coaching change. We've been one of the better defensive teams in the nation for the last three years and it hasn't translated to significant success in the NCAA tourney. I like defense as much as the next person, but you have to have at least some offense if you're going to make a run in the tournament. Again, if your winning statement applies to the 4th choice above, then I guess you're happy. If making a serious run in the NCAA is your goal, this poor offense will never get it done. We must have both!

Now that the recruiting has taken a step up with our Frosh this year and the big guys coming next year I would hope that we will see a progression in the offense. We are getting better skilled players. Mick has shown that he can teach defense, now getting better offense and overall skill/IQ guys I think that the offense will blossom.

 

[L-T]

It all starts with making the Dance. Would I like the program to progress into a Duke,Ky level of success. Sure! Hopeful Mick can lead us there. He is growing and so is the Program. I've seen steady progress since the day he took over. I guess to answer your question, I'm very happy Were we are and glad we have Coach Cronin.

Waite, you and I will never agree, but that's ok. I know you're a great Bearcat fan as am I. If I am right about our coach, youll eventually be a happy Bearcat, and if you're right, I'll be happy too. I think we both want exactly the same thing for this program. We just disagree on the best way to get there. We want something better than what we had with Huggs. If we get to that point, who really cares who got us there. I'm not patient. I don't want this process to take 20 years.

The statute of limitations has run out on what Mick inherited 8 years ago. Let's go ahead and throw away his 1st 4 years and give him an "A" for digging us out of the abyss. Lets assume we hand the program over to a great up and coming young coach beginning year 5 with Yancy, Dixon, Cash, Bishop, and the boys....and turn him lose. Are we really happy here in year 4? After the sweet 16 run and being ranked preseason the next year, starting 12-0, rising to #8 in the rankings, then bombing at home to New Mexico and losing 2 more of the next 3 games to fall out of the rankings, losing 6 of the last 9 league games, losing in the 2nd game of the league tourney, and out in the 1st round of the NCAA, followed by this season's embarrassing loss to New Mexico and blowout loss to Xavier again, this trend is certainly not up. We've also had embarrassing home losses to Presbyterian and Marshall during this time. Our fans have not been impressed and still don't attend games. Should we really be happy now? Is there really a light at the end of this tunnel? Once again, we're seeing promise in the"potential" of recruits. But, one thing we've learned with Mick's recruits to this point, they have been a lot more "underwhelming" than "overwhelming".

I really like this years recruits so far. Yes, next years recruits sound promising, but he has recruited not a single shooter in spite of losing Kilpatrick at season's end. So now we are at the mercy of depending on Mick developing our current players into great shooters and our big men into great offensive contributors. Are you really confident that will happen? I don't think he will be fired, so we are going to definitely watch your senario play out. Time will tell who is right.

 

[bearcat jeff]

What Mick inherited is no longer an excuse but in looking at the body of his work it has to be considered. In my mind, once his first 4 year players made it to their senior year the rebuilding was done because Mick then had a team of "his guys".

I think the future is bright for UC. There was a synergy around the program in the 90's that hasn't been recaptured and that is not even debatable, but the recent success of the program gives me hope. The multiple first/second round losses in the NCAA had already begun to remove that luster. Nancy Zimpher poured acid on it.

I don't envy Mick following a UC legend and taking on the project he undertook and noone else wanted. He's done an admirable if not spectacular job. The best thing we can do as fans is continue to support the program.

 

[waterhead]

Waite, you and I will never agree, but that's ok. I know you're a great Bearcat fan as am I. If I am right about our coach, youll eventually be a happy Bearcat, and if you're right, I'll be happy too. I think we both want exactly the same thing for this program. We just disagree on the best way to get there. We want something better than what we had with Huggs. If we get to that point, who really cares who got us there. I'm not patient. I don't want this process to take 20 years.

The statute of limitations has run out on what Mick inherited 8 years ago. Let's go ahead and throw away his 1st 4 years and give him an "A" for digging us out of the abyss. Lets assume we hand the program over to a great up and coming young coach beginning year 5 with Yancy, Dixon, Cash, Bishop, and the boys....and turn him lose. Are we really happy here in year 4? After the sweet 16 run and being ranked preseason the next year, starting 12-0, rising to #8 in the rankings, then bombing at home to New Mexico and losing 2 more of the next 3 games to fall out of the rankings, losing 6 of the last 9 league games, losing in the 2nd game of the league tourney, and out in the 1st round of the NCAA, followed by this season's embarrassing loss to New Mexico and blowout loss to Xavier again, this trend is certainly not up. We've also had embarrassing home losses to Presbyterian and Marshall during this time. Our fans have not been impressed and still don't attend games. Should we really be happy now? Is there really a light at the end of this tunnel? Once again, we're seeing promise in the"potential" of recruits. But, one thing we've learned with Mick's recruits to this point, they have been a lot more "underwhelming" than "overwhelming".

I really like this years recruits so far. Yes, next years recruits sound promising, but he has recruited not a single shooter in spite of losing Kilpatrick at season's end. So now we are at the mercy of depending on Mick developing our current players into great shooters and our big men into great offensive contributors. Are you really confident that will happen? I don't think he will be fired, so we are going to definitely watch your senario play out. Time will tell who is right.

Hey, we all wish it would happen faster no doubt. It's been tough for Mick to have all the pieces in place for 2-3 years in a row. Depth to press and quality at at least 4 of 5 positions. The one time I think he had most of that was Gates' senior year and that turned out pretty well. It's either been rebuilding or bad timing or barely losing on a few stud players to other programs.

For the final two recruits of the 2014 class I would like to see a shooter/scorer (Graham) and a defensive eraser at C (Mahmoud or the other guy). Then in 2015 replace Guyn with a PG. I think if we can get Graham we can get one of our other guards to be a consistent outside threat.

That would certainly give Cronin just about everything he has wanted or needed (I know not having some of that is on him). However, I do like that we are going to be more offensively skilled than we were with players like JJ, Mooj, TR, JS, GG, Dixon, Bishop, etc...but not at the detriment to our athletecism on D except perhaps at C (for now) or even PG since Caupain could use more of it.

This is why I would like to see what he can do with these players...not as much this year or next...but the following 1 or 2. I am NOT saying I don't think we can or will be great this year or next...just a probability thing.

What I think we will have is a VERY good PG. 2 forwards at each position with some cross over potential from PF to C or PF to SF. 2 centers with SOME offensive ability. Two SG's with athletic ability through the roof. We could potentially have some great teams with just these players but if we can plug a few holes we could really be great.

 

[BearcatMick]

Mick's philosophy is fine. The players just need to settle down and hit their open shots offensively