2016-2017 Season

[CHEER CINCY]

What I find odd is people expecting more out of players that they've never seen play at this level.

I guarantee that Coach Cronin would 100% disagree with a statement like Washington will be better than Ellis in ever way imaginable.

Based on what? Every off season it's the same people making the same outrageous claims about how much better we're going to be because of players they've never seen play the game. Heck, last season LT even got sucked in and proclaimed Justin Jenifer as the next Isiah Thomas.

FYI, I'm very calm, I like the optimism from most, it's what makes for interesting debates. No one was posting on this thread until a few people started having some doubts about next season. If everyone agreed all the time there wouldn't be very many posts on this board.

The majority of players on our team last year could/would have fit in very nicely on a Div 2 all-star squad (Shaq, Cobb, Ellis, Deberry, etc) My hope is with some solid D1 talent (Evans, Washington, Clark, and Caupain) leading the charge, we can at least improve. Then again, we have JJ, Quadri, and KJ returning who I am not sure would even fit nicely onto a Div 2 squad

I enter every year of UC basketball with excitement. I also enter EVERY year of UC basketball under Mick Cronin with uncertainty.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

What kind of buzz will there be for the team this year from more casual fans? I don't live in the city anymore so it's hard for me to get a pulse for what the local fans expect. Will attendance be down? Seems like there was a lot of hype last year, and hope to see a more uptempo/entertaining style of play. Since we obviously didn't get that (and fans of the other team in the city did), I wonder if the disappointment has numbed some of the more bandwagon/borderline supporters.

 

[L-T]

What kind of buzz will there be for the team this year from more casual fans? I don't live in the city anymore so it's hard for me to get a pulse for what the local fans expect. Will attendance be down? Seems like there was a lot of hype last year, and hope to see a more uptempo/entertaining style of play. Since we obviously didn't get that (and fans of the other team in the city did), I wonder if the disappointment has numbed some of the more bandwagon/borderline supporters.

Mick drew 8,831 fans per game 10 years ago in his first year as coach with a God-awful team. 10 years later, he had his best attendance year ever at 9,415, a mere 584 fans more per game than when the program was in the dungeon of college basketball. He has only increased attendance a freaking 584 fans per game in a decade. He has not outdrawn Xavier in a single season since he has been head coach, even though we have a gazillion more alums in this town than they have....and that is with the bargain basement ticket packages and prices to try to attract more fans. Xavier had never outdrawn us before Mick showed up. They had never been close either. That more than anything is an indictment of his performance.

There is zero "buzz" for UC Basketball for 2016/2017, and this stellar spring recruiting hasn't helped. From this state of the program, we will attempt once again to have that illusive "special" season. I look for attendance to be about the same and may go up if we start winning consistently and catch some momentum. There was some decent pre-season hype last year, deservedly so, but the final results were a big disappointment. Even with the hype, I was told season ticket sales were as low as ever last season. If it starts looking like a typical Cronin "respectable" season again, on the heels of last season's disappointment, and with Xavier looking elite again, attendance could take a tumble.

 

[justinhub2003]

Mick drew 8,831 fans per game 10 years ago in his first year as coach with a God-awful team. 10 years later, he had his best attendance year ever at 9,415, a mere 584 fans more per game than when the program was in the dungeon of college basketball. He has only increased attendance a freaking 584 fans per game in a decade. He has not outdrawn Xavier in a single season since he has been head coach, even though we have a gazillion more alums in this town than they have....and that is with the bargain basement ticket packages and prices to try to attract more fans. Xavier had never outdrawn us before Mick showed up. They had never been close either. That more than anything is an indictment of his performance.

There is zero "buzz" for UC Basketball for 2016/2017, and this stellar spring recruiting hasn't helped. From this state of the program, we will attempt once again to have that illusive "special" season. I look for attendance to be about the same and may go up if we start winning consistently and catch some momentum. There was some decent pre-season hype last year, deservedly so, but the final results were a big disappointment. Even with the hype, I was told season ticket sales were as low as ever last season. If it starts looking like a typical Cronin "respectable" season again, on the heels of last season's disappointment, and with Xavier looking elite again, attendance could take a tumble.

Your a season ticket holder, im sure you realize how many absolutely terrible seats fifth third has.

Cintas on the other hand, has great seats everywhere.


So uc plays the cake teams in early part of the season, or thr weak teams in our conference, people dont go to those games because why put up with bad sightlines for a game that might be better suited for home.

But when uc plays big teams, the place is rockin and sold out. Lets see what happns in a new arena

 

[L-T]

Your a season ticket holder, im sure you realize how many absolutely terrible seats fifth third has.

Cintas on the other hand, has great seats everywhere.


So uc plays the cake teams in early part of the season, or thr weak teams in our conference, people dont go to those games because why put up with bad sightlines for a game that might be better suited for home.

But when uc plays big teams, the place is rockin and sold out. Lets see what happns in a new arena

Cintas has been in existence since 2000. Even when it was brand new, they couldn't get near our attendance average. As I've said many times, the arena is just a big excuse . A good coach would have no trouble filling the Shoe if he was moving the program where it should be and playing an exciting brand of basketball. To only be drawing 582 more fans than when the program had one returning scholarship player and a record of 11-19 is just unfathomable. Lets not wait and see what happens in a new arena. Lets start playing exciting basketball that attracts good recruits and see what happens. We're going at it backwards....hoping a new arena will lift up an average coach. I got news for you. Cronin is not recruiting. How long do you think a new arena with much higher ticket prices will attract fans to watch sub-par recruits playing boring basketball? Not very long!

 

[Chad Brendel]

To say a roster with 2 all conference starters and an all freshman selection joining a top 50 incoming freshman and a 4 star transfer is a group lacking talent is frankly ignorant and said with no purpose other than to flame the discussion. But you do you, L-T...

 

[L-T]

To say a roster with 2 all conference starters and an all freshman selection joining a top 50 incoming freshman and a 4 star transfer is a group lacking talent is frankly ignorant and said with no purpose other than to flame the discussion. But you do you, L-T...

10 years of nothing but talent. That is why the demand for tickets is bursting at the seams. Last year's roster supposedly had great talent too. How did that work out? Your little buddy always has a roster full of potential. Last year, that talent and potential got us 4th place in this juggernaut mid major league. If there is one thing we've learned under this coach, don't believe the hype. You obviously believe it. And you're calling me ignorant? I'll believe it when I see it. Thanks for doing you Chad........

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Really excited for next season. Starting 5 is very good and I'm still holding out hope the staff will add another player. Team should be very competitive in the league in both regular season and conference tourney. They will make the NCAA again which is my favorite sporting event to follow. Once there anything can happen.

 

[coverley]

To say a roster with 2 all conference starters and an all freshman selection joining a top 50 incoming freshman and a 4 star transfer is a group lacking talent is frankly ignorant and said with no purpose other than to flame the discussion. But you do you, L-T...

Spot on Chad. I choose to be very optimistic about this year. It will be a fun team to watch as the season plays out. I don't blame the naysayers, they just choose to be negative, not a great way to go through life. The constant references to Cronin as the "little guy" are very childish however.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

The "naysayers" may just be tired of the same cycle year after year. I appreciate the effort some of you make to try to spin everything in a positive direction, but not living up to expectations year after year grows old. It cracks me up when people act like not thinking that UC is going to be as good as others do, means you must go through life as a negative person. I don't want to speak for everyone, but I think most of us have lives outside of this board and team lol. And it's really as simple to me as having no interest in talking myself into believing something that I have very serious doubts about. And I won't be bullied into toeing the party lines and conforming to the group-think. Every year it's something. Last year it was that we were on the floor with Kentucky for a while, we had the whole team back, we were going to push the pace, Ellis was Preseason 1st Team AAC, etc. And we saw what happened. This year apparently it's about Cumberland and Washington's recruiting rankings (which is funny bc most of the time we talk about how flawed those ratings are), and having a good starting 5 (which is just code for: No Bench).

Anyway, I'm just not going to go all in and expect anything in the preseason anymore. If some think that's somehow a reflection on me as a person, then lol. I don't know why it's so important to some of you to have everyone believe exactly as you do. I've been around this board long enough to recognize the tactics. But there's a track record with our coach, who is the constant, that I just have a hard time ignoring. I hope I'm wrong. I really do. I really hope all the things the "good" fans say come true. But I don't feel like setting myself up for disappointment again when we're struggling to get out of the 50s in every single AAC road game, whether we're playing a tournament team, or team that ranks in the bottom 100 of Division 1 basketball. I really wish I could get in on the "positive spin" with some of you guys, but I watch the games. And until I am given the pleasure of watching something else (which isn't totally impossible), I just can't get there.

 

[HarryBosch]

The "naysayers" may just be tired of the same cycle year after year. I appreciate the effort some of you make to try to spin everything in a positive direction, but not living up to expectations year after year grows old. It cracks me up when people act like not thinking that UC is going to be as good as others do, means you must go through life as a negative person. I don't want to speak for everyone, but I think most of us have lives outside of this board and team lol. And it's really as simple to me as having no interest in talking myself into believing something that I have very serious doubts about. And I won't be bullied into toeing the party lines and conforming to the group-think. Every year it's something. Last year it was that we were on the floor with Kentucky for a while, we had the whole team back, we were going to push the pace, Ellis was Preseason 1st Team AAC, etc. And we saw what happened. This year apparently it's about Cumberland and Washington's recruiting rankings (which is funny bc most of the time we talk about how flawed those ratings are), and having a good starting 5 (which is just code for: No Bench).

Anyway, I'm just not going to go all in and expect anything in the preseason anymore. If some think that's somehow a reflection on me as a person, then lol. I don't know why it's so important to some of you to have everyone believe exactly as you do. I've been around this board long enough to recognize the tactics. But there's a track record with our coach, who is the constant, that I just have a hard time ignoring. I hope I'm wrong. I really do. I really hope all the things the "good" fans say come true. But I don't feel like setting myself up for disappointment again when we're struggling to get out of the 50s in every single AAC road game, whether we're playing a tournament team, or team that ranks in the bottom 100 of Division 1 basketball. I really wish I could get in on the "positive spin" with some of you guys, but I watch the games. And until I am given the pleasure of watching something else (which isn't totally impossible), I just can't get there.

AMEN Brother Jacob.

 

[#BearcatNation]

Nobody is stopping anyone from having an opinion. Although, I do think that most people come to this forum to talk UC hoops in a relatively positive manner. Not in a "fairy-tale" manner where everything is perfect, but who personally enjoys logging in every day to type/read paragraphs upon paragraphs railing where the program is now? What good comes from it? To most readers (feel free to disagree), I think it's depressing and annoying to read similar rants over and over that spin everything into a negative light. Does anyone get any joy about reading "Mick killed the program" nearly daily here? I can't imagine. Maybe I'm just more happy-go-lucky, but it seems excessive, when it's not even true to me. It'd be different if Mick was really struggling here, but that's not even the case. Call me nuts, but I think most would rather hear "I think these guys need to step it up this year" over "OMG Mick can't recruit or sell out any games" in late June. Someone tell me I'm off-base here.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

Nobody is stopping anyone from having an opinion. Although, I do think that most people come to this forum to talk UC hoops in a relatively positive manner. Not in a "fairy-tale" manner where everything is perfect, but who personally enjoys logging in every day to type/read paragraphs upon paragraphs railing where the program is now? What good comes from it? To most readers (feel free to disagree), I think it's depressing and annoying to read similar rants over and over that spin everything into a negative light. Does anyone get any joy about reading "Mick killed the program" nearly daily here? I can't imagine. Maybe I'm just more happy-go-lucky, but it seems excessive, when it's not even true to me. It'd be different if Mick was really struggling here, but that's not even the case. Call me nuts, but I think most would rather hear "I think these guys need to step it up this year" over "OMG Mick can't recruit or sell out any games" in late June. Someone tell me I'm off-base here.

I don't think you're off-base bc you clearly understand where people are coming from. And you don't use someone's opinion about a sports team as an indictment on their personal life or intelligence level. There are just different schools of thought. What's annoying to read for some might really hit home for others, and vice versa. I personally feel the need to push back at times on the happy-go-lucky bc I fear that can lead down the path of living with any results, and just being happy to have a team to root for. It can feel like Groundhog Day in here sometimes to me and people tend to have a short memory imo. As soon as a season ends, we hit the reset button and go right back to all the reasons why we'll be better next year. I guess being a Cincinnati sports fan (all sports) has made me a bit more skeptical/jaded/whatever you want to call it. I am at the point where I won't believe it until I see it. I mean, imagine how someone would've been treated if they would've come on here last year before the season saying we'd get 5th in the league, get a worse NCAA seed, and go 0-2 in the postseason. They would've been a pariah. But they also would've been correct. Bottom line for me is I'm tired of pointing at all these things that will make us elite, and treating people who don't see it that way like they're obviously stupid...even if they turn out to be right. Bc those people are never vindicated within the fan base. The reset button is pushed and we do it all over again. Call it negative, call me a naysayer, call me what you will (and I don't mean you specifically), but I'm not getting burned and buying in until I see a team that can consistently score 60 points against relatively weak competition, outside of our own gym. It's been too common for us since joining the AAC to find ourselves in rock fights with garbage teams. As soon as that stops, I'll be right back on board with setting the bar high.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

I don't think you're off-base bc you clearly understand where people are coming from. And you don't use someone's opinion about a sports team as an indictment on their personal life or intelligence level. There are just different schools of thought. What's annoying to read for some might really hit home for others, and vice versa. I personally feel the need to push back at times on the happy-go-lucky bc I fear that can lead down the path of living with any results, and just being happy to have a team to root for. It can feel like Groundhog Day in here sometimes to me and people tend to have a short memory imo. As soon as a season ends, we hit the reset button and go right back to all the reasons why we'll be better next year. I guess being a Cincinnati sports fan (all sports) has made me a bit more skeptical/jaded/whatever you want to call it. I am at the point where I won't believe it until I see it. I mean, imagine how someone would've been treated if they would've come on here last year before the season saying we'd get 5th in the league, get a worse NCAA seed, and go 0-2 in the postseason. They would've been a pariah. But they also would've been correct. Bottom line for me is I'm tired of pointing at all these things that will make us elite, and treating people who don't see it that way like they're obviously stupid...even if they turn out to be right. Bc those people are never vindicated within the fan base. The reset button is pushed and we do it all over again. Call it negative, call me a naysayer, call me what you will (and I don't mean you specifically), but I'm not getting burned and buying in until I see a team that can consistently score 60 points against relatively weak competition, outside of our own gym. It's been too common for us since joining the AAC to find ourselves in rock fights with garbage teams. As soon as that stops, I'll be right back on board with setting the bar high.

Jake one mans junk is another mans treasure. Your entitled to any view you desire. You can set the bar anywhere you want to. Your views may be based on different factors then others. Same as me. If your unhappy with the team's standing that's your opinion. I personally enjoy the team and like what it represents and how the coach conducts himself and the expectations he sets for his players on and off the court. I also appreciate all the obstacles he has to overcome in today's college athletics. If your view is different I'm fine with that. I really would think a coach satisfaction thread should be established so every thread isn't turned into a battle between pro Mick and anti Mick comments.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

Jake one mans junk is another mans treasure. Your entitled to any view you desire. You can set the bar anywhere you want to. Your views may be based on different factors then others. Same as me. If your unhappy with the team's standing that's your opinion. I personally enjoy the team and like what it represents and how the coach conducts himself and the expectations he sets for his players on and off the court. I also appreciate all the obstacles he has to overcome in today's college athletics. If your view is different I'm fine with that. I really would think a coach satisfaction thread should be established so every thread isn't turned into a battle between pro Mick and anti Mick comments.

I feel like my comments are tied into my expectations/outlook for next season.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

I feel like my comments are tied into my expectations/outlook for next season.

not pointing to your comments specifically just trying to offer a alternative going forward.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

not pointing to your comments specifically just trying to offer a alternative going forward.

We used to have a "State of the Program" thread. I'll try to dig it up so some of the conversations that spin towards that can be directed accordingly.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

We used to have a "State of the Program" thread. I'll try to dig it up so some of the conversations that spin towards that can be directed accordingly.

Thanks Jake this should satisfy everyone. Those who want to debate Cronin as a coach can do so without turning every thread into a battle. It also means people can avoid such comments while still allowing those with a different opinion a place to air their displeasure.

 

[jacobkdoyle]

Thanks Jake this should satisfy everyone. Those who want to debate Cronin as a coach can do so without turning every thread into a battle. It also means people can avoid such comments while still allowing those with a different opinion a place to air their displeasure.

Good deal.

 

[WAITE HOYT 2]

Think with two all league performers and adding Washington and Cumberland to the mix should make for a nice season. Really think the staff will add a final piece to the bench to help with depth. If we can't find the right fit I'm fine carrying the scholly's forward rather then tie it up with a 4 year guy who won't make a impact.