Crosstown shootout

[ralph1950]

If you could, would you care to elaborate on how the two situations are very similar? I don't believe any Xavier players had any problems with the law while attending Xavier, and I don't believe Mack has had any problems with the law, as Huggins did. I'm interested to hear how they are similar at all, let alone "very" similar.

Unless, do you think trash talking on the court is the same as breaking the law?

Chris Mack has no integrity.

 

[ralph1950]

XU is a locker room full of gangstas.

 

[Thegreatone]

Done. As long as we can both agree trash talking happens every game. Some people seem to think it's a huge deal that Xavier has players that talk trash. Those people just don't understand that it is part of the game now.

I was honestly surprised at how many UC fans got all butthurt because of some trash talk.

Look what your "trash talk" got you. You continued to downplay the brawl but the fallout continues to hurt the program.

 

[mplebanon]

Lyons gone.

UC should kick their butt by 30 or 40 next year and then cancel the series.

 

[Thegreatone]

Strong indications are that shootout is being moved next year to US Bank.

 

[Kingsley Court]

Strong indications are that shootout is being moved next year to US Bank.

That would be an awful decision, IMO. Imagine for a second, that the game was at US bank this past year, there would be so many fights in the stands. If it really is about keeping players "safe", I don't think moving the game to a neutral site does that. I could see where it would make things more dangerous, TBH.

Even in blow outs, with one teams fans cheering and rubbing it in, I guarantee there would be a fight. I would be shocked if there wasn't at least 1 fight in the stands every year if they play at a neutral site.

 

[Thegreatone]

That would be an awful decision, IMO. Imagine for a second, that the game was at US bank this past year, there would be so many fights in the stands. If it really is about keeping players "safe", I don't think moving the game to a neutral site does that. I could see where it would make things more dangerous, TBH.

Even in blow outs, with one teams fans cheering and rubbing it in, I guarantee there would be a fight. I would be shocked if there wasn't at least 1 fight in the stands every year if they play at a neutral site.

I agree paritially. I think it would be a terrible decision.

I do not think there would be too many fights during the game or in the stands. I think walking out of US Bank would be where you see a lot of arguements and some fights.

Rumor is that Cincy administration has made the decision to not go back to Cinta's again and that Xavier obviously wouldnt come to Cincy each year so the only option is US Bank.

 

[Kingsley Court]

I do not think there would be too many fights during the game or in the stands. I think walking out of US Bank would be where you see a lot of arguements and some fights.

Rumor is that Cincy administration has made the decision to not go back to Cinta's again and that Xavier obviously wouldnt come to Cincy each year so the only option is US Bank.

That's included in my "fights" argument. I don't think there would be many, if any at all player fights. Maybe a little in your face after a foul but nothing like last year. I do think there would be a lot of fan fights.

I haven't seen that rumor, but if true it would be disappointing in my book.

 

[cincycpaw]

What a bunch of idiots. Moving the series to US Bank or canceling it is a terrible idea. I'm embarrassed by them if true.

 

[Eternal E]

Cintas center is a horrible environment. I do not see any major OOC games there for X in the future.

 

[ralph1950]

That's included in my "fights" argument. I don't think there would be many, if any at all player fights. Maybe a little in your face after a foul but nothing like last year. I do think there would be a lot of fan fights.

I haven't seen that rumor, but if true it would be disappointing in my book.

XU should consider themselves fortunate that UC will continue to play them at all. If the decision was 100% up to Mick the game would be canceled. UC willing to continue to play X at US Bank Arena is UC throwing X a major bone.

 

[Kingsley Court]

XU should consider themselves fortunate that UC will continue to play them at all. If the decision was 100% up to Mick the game would be canceled. UC willing to continue to play X at US Bank Arena is UC throwing X a major bone.

Of course Mick doesn't want to keep playing it. The best team he has had while at UC just got embarrassed by 23 by his crosstown rival. Mick is scared, I think that's pretty clear.

He has already said he doesn't want it to continue, lets see if the UC administration backs it's coach, or chooses to go against their coach. Will be interesting to see.

 

[TheShoeFits]

Of course Mick doesn't want to keep playing it. The best team he has had while at UC just got embarrassed by 23 by his crosstown rival. Mick is scared, I think that's pretty clear.

He has already said he doesn't want it to continue, lets see if the UC administration backs it's coach, or chooses to go against their coach. Will be interesting to see.

Then again, the worst team Mick has had beat Xavier by 10.


http://espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=263472132

 

[Thegreatone]

Of course Mick doesn't want to keep playing it. The best team he has had while at UC just got embarrassed by 23 by his crosstown rival. Mick is scared, I think that's pretty clear.

He has already said he doesn't want it to continue, lets see if the UC administration backs it's coach, or chooses to go against their coach. Will be interesting to see.

You both continue the same arguement.

 

[JasonS]

You both continue the same arguement.

...and it is annoying.

 

[Thegreatone]

Of course Mick doesn't want to keep playing it. The best team he has had while at UC just got embarrassed by 23 by his crosstown rival. Mick is scared, I think that's pretty clear.

He has already said he doesn't want it to continue, lets see if the UC administration backs it's coach, or chooses to go against their coach. Will be interesting to see.

Same old same old.

It wasnt all that long ago that UC beat Xavier by 20.

I am losing more respect for Coach Mack. He is now trying to get Lyons back... He doesnt get it.

 

[Thegreatone]

The amount of transfers under Mack is getting impressive.

Brian Walsh, Mark Lyons, Jay Canty, Jordan Latham, and Griffin McKenzie in a whopping 3 years.

To compare to Mick I believe we have had 2 transfers.

Tim Crowell - who was always going to be a one year player. He knew that coming in and Mick knew it.

Alvin Mitchell

That is in 6 years. You have to wonder what is going on over there. This also suggests Mick doesnt like to force people out and we could be in that situation soon if Ennis and Obepka pick us.

 

[Bobbiewilliamsux]

As a Xavier fan, I don't post here often. I've read through a decent amount of the posts so far in this thread. With that being said, I think Mack did lose control of his ballclub for a period of time last season after the shootout. They did show a lack of maturity that a senior laden team needs in order to put something like that incident behind them. I would be lying if I didn't, at times, begin to lose faith in Mack.

With that said, and I know people will go straight to pointing to the fact that they played a 15 seed in the tournament to get to the sweet sixteen, but the fact remains they were there. They did come together towards the end of the season last year, and in many cases, Mack did out coach his opposition. Which was something that we, as Xavier fans, had not experienced a ton of during the season.

Sometimes it takes a young coach time to find his "sea legs" and learn how to coach, and how to truly take that step from the top assistant to the head coach position. I know Mick has done it, but he absolutely had to go through some growing pains as a coach, and the dismissal of Alvin Mitchell is a great example of this.

Lyons brought a ton to the table athletically. He was loud and I can certainly see where he could get under a lot of people's skin. He will get his degree, and move on to another program. I think his dismissal however, is another sign that Mack is taking that next step in becoming a good coach. Sometimes tough decisions need to be made.

Finally, Yes, those players that the greatone pointed out did transfer out of the program, but in each one of those instances (with the exception of Lyons) that player was not going to see significant time throughout their career. This can happen for various reason, but Canty and Latham both left to be closer to home, and Mckenzie was the product of 3 months of AAU ball. I'm not saying that Mack is at the point where he is a great, or even a good coach, but as a fan of the program, I do believe that he is taking the right steps to becoming a more complete coach.

 

[Thegreatone]

As a Xavier fan, I don't post here often. I've read through a decent amount of the posts so far in this thread. With that being said, I think Mack did lose control of his ballclub for a period of time last season after the shootout. They did show a lack of maturity that a senior laden team needs in order to put something like that incident behind them. I would be lying if I didn't, at times, begin to lose faith in Mack.

With that said, and I know people will go straight to pointing to the fact that they played a 15 seed in the tournament to get to the sweet sixteen, but the fact remains they were there. They did come together towards the end of the season last year, and in many cases, Mack did out coach his opposition. Which was something that we, as Xavier fans, had not experienced a ton of during the season.

Sometimes it takes a young coach time to find his "sea legs" and learn how to coach, and how to truly take that step from the top assistant to the head coach position. I know Mick has done it, but he absolutely had to go through some growing pains as a coach, and the dismissal of Alvin Mitchell is a great example of this.

Lyons brought a ton to the table athletically. He was loud and I can certainly see where he could get under a lot of people's skin. He will get his degree, and move on to another program. I think his dismissal however, is another sign that Mack is taking that next step in becoming a good coach. Sometimes tough decisions need to be made.

Finally, Yes, those players that the greatone pointed out did transfer out of the program, but in each one of those instances (with the exception of Lyons) that player was not going to see significant time throughout their career. This can happen for various reason, but Canty and Latham both left to be closer to home, and Mckenzie was the product of 3 months of AAU ball. I'm not saying that Mack is at the point where he is a great, or even a good coach, but as a fan of the program, I do believe that he is taking the right steps to becoming a more complete coach.

Good post as usual.

I agree with your assessment of Mack taking control. Would you say these guys who transfered were swing and miss type of recruits or guys that didnt want to go through the growing pains of waiting for their turn?

Taking this to a higher level, what do you guys think about the crazy amount of transfers lately? Nobody is happy working hard and being a role player. Waiting their turn.

That is one of the major reasons I love Parker. Never bitched about never playing his sophomore year and worked his ass off to become a starter during his junior year.

I think getting buy in is crucial. SK willing to redshirt when Lance came in was another good example of getting the buy in.

Jeff, do you think this is due to recruiting strategies of promising the world and not being able to deliver (not in cincy case as we have been pretty good at this, but in college recruiting in general)

 

[Cpaw]

As a Xavier fan, I don't post here often. I've read through a decent amount of the posts so far in this thread. With that being said, I think Mack did lose control of his ballclub for a period of time last season after the shootout. They did show a lack of maturity that a senior laden team needs in order to put something like that incident behind them. I would be lying if I didn't, at times, begin to lose faith in Mack.

With that said, and I know people will go straight to pointing to the fact that they played a 15 seed in the tournament to get to the sweet sixteen, but the fact remains they were there. They did come together towards the end of the season last year, and in many cases, Mack did out coach his opposition. Which was something that we, as Xavier fans, had not experienced a ton of during the season.

Sometimes it takes a young coach time to find his "sea legs" and learn how to coach, and how to truly take that step from the top assistant to the head coach position. I know Mick has done it, but he absolutely had to go through some growing pains as a coach, and the dismissal of Alvin Mitchell is a great example of this.

Lyons brought a ton to the table athletically. He was loud and I can certainly see where he could get under a lot of people's skin. He will get his degree, and move on to another program. I think his dismissal however, is another sign that Mack is taking that next step in becoming a good coach. Sometimes tough decisions need to be made.

Finally, Yes, those players that the greatone pointed out did transfer out of the program, but in each one of those instances (with the exception of Lyons) that player was not going to see significant time throughout their career. This can happen for various reason, but Canty and Latham both left to be closer to home, and Mckenzie was the product of 3 months of AAU ball. I'm not saying that Mack is at the point where he is a great, or even a good coach, but as a fan of the program, I do believe that he is taking the right steps to becoming a more complete coach.

Thanks for visiting and making a great post. I believe you may be right with Mack needing to get his sea legs, and time will tell if that is the case. I don't necesarily like the guy, but I like the idea that 2 strong local programs are being led by local kids that graduated from the institution they are leading. It is a pretty neat thing and speaks volumes to the city.
As for the transfers, the one I question and put on Mack is that of Mckenzie. it seems as thought Mack may have mislead him to land his services by offering playing time. I wonder if this may have been the reason he chose X over UC since this seems to be the stigma following Cronin is he does not mislead recruits in regards to their PT.
Just my 2 cents.